14 bolt front build thread and tech help

paradisepwoffrd · Aug 16, 2016

Re:

If they are making a bracket for wilwoods, might be feasible to adapt some type of Toyota caliper. IIRC, folks are using the newer Toyota stuff with good success and better braking.

If you keep the rotor diameter close (13+"), the smaller dual piston calipers will likely work fine.

It won't be as good as stock parts, but not as heavy and won't require boosted master. In a lightweight buggy, I'd like to run manual brakes for weight and simplicity.

Mortalis5509 · Aug 16, 2016

Re: Re: 14 bolt front build thread and tech help

sleepsontoilet said:
If you're buying a housing, retubing, new gears, new carrier, etc is it still cheaper/stronger than just buying a fabricated housing and a 9/10" diff? It seems like it would be heavier, and more limited on diff placement than a fabricated housing also. Trying to learn, not start a passing match.

As stated the 14 would be cheaper but the strength per a debate on pirate has the 10" stronger.

I have hi pinion 10" gear works with spools for the front and rear with billet 1480 yokes.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

Beefcake · Aug 20, 2016

For what its worth I re-tubed my 14 bolt completely, I had the option to sleeve for a lot less money and went against it, one piece that is thicker is always better then two. It also made for IMO a cleaner look you don't have a big weld prep with a bunch of plug welds on the long side of the axle tube.

I also had the offset set to GM offset but in a drive drop configuration to allow more room to mount my link and shock tabs. It also allowed me to run OEM shafts if I wanted to from my old rig.

With all that being said I shaved the housing used TMR's plate with GLO diff cover and cut it down myself that alone saved $250+. I'm running solid industries inner C's, Knuckles over sized spindles, hubs and drive flanges to run 40 spline shafts. Also planned on running 40spline.com's spool.

I added everything up and i'm actually in it for less then when I bought a GM dana 60 stock and built it. :****:

redneckengineered · Aug 22, 2016

Beefcake said:
For what its worth I re-tubed my 14 bolt completely, I had the option to sleeve for a lot less money and went against it, one piece that is thicker is always better then two. It also made for IMO a cleaner look you don't have a big weld prep with a bunch of plug welds on the long side of the axle tube.

I also had the offset set to GM offset but in a drive drop configuration to allow more room to mount my link and shock tabs. It also allowed me to run OEM shafts if I wanted to from my old rig.

With all that being said I shaved the housing used TMR's plate with GLO diff cover and cut it down myself that alone saved $250+. I'm running solid industries inner C's, Knuckles over sized spindles, hubs and drive flanges to run 40 spline shafts. Also planned on running 40spline.com's spool.

I added everything up and i'm actually in it for less then when I bought a GM dana 60 stock and built it. :****:

That's a good point, I was talking about this the other day. If starting from scratch, apples to apples, there's not a whole lot of difference between building a 60 vs 14 front. You got the machine work but other than that it's all pretty much the same.

redneckengineered · Aug 22, 2016

Got to see in person to appreciate the size/beef of these

redneckengineered · Aug 22, 2016

Got my unit bearings ordered up. Cheapest price I found was Rock Auto at $201.79 each. Timken SP940200.

Hiapo · Aug 22, 2016

Did you ever explain the retube you are going to do? Im interested in how this will get done. Parts look freaking awesome.

redneckengineered · Aug 22, 2016

Hiapo said:
Did you ever explain the retube you are going to do? Im interested in how this will get done. Parts look freaking awesome.

No. I've got it mostly ironed out and don't think I'm going to have to reinvent the wheel or spend a ton of money on machine work. Been holding off to do the explanation once I can get my hands on the actual housing to verify measurement and add some pictures. Just waiting on my housing to get here...should be tomorrow. I'm pretty excited about it. A lot of research went into it and some help from the online community (hardline and pirate) really paid off so I plan to post all the info up in hopes it will help others :woot:

Hiapo · Aug 22, 2016

Im going to do a 14 front myself and plan on copying your build, so looking forward to seeing this completed.

redneckengineered · Aug 24, 2016

So I believe I've found my unicorn. Sumbitch is massive. I will here on out refer to it as diddy's big block 14 bolt. Anyone that knows me will get that joke.

I have to say I haven't had this much fun junkyard diving, researching and gathering tech info since the first buggy I built back in the early 2000s when I didn't know WTF I was doing most of the time. I just got the axle yesterday afternoon so I haven't had a chance to go through everything but here is what I know so far...

housing: 2010 Chevy 3500 Van dually to the best of my knowledge
WMS is like 74", it's wide AF
5/8" casting all the way around, no flat spot
4" factory tubes, unsure on thickness but will chop these off soon and report back. They do not neck down at the casting.
Factory 1480 yoke

For those of you wondering why I went to all the trouble to find this axle instead of just retubing a 2nd gen 14 bolt with 3.5 1/2" wall like everyone else, it's for a few reasons. Reid wasn't going to have stock on the 3.5 bore knuckles until late Fall. Not acceptable. I like doing things a little different than others. Depending on configuration, 4" tube is stronger and lighter than 3.5" tube. 4" tube drops panties.

Just for fun, I've been playing with some numbers.
3.5" 1/2" wall tube - 16.06 lbs/ft
4" .25" wall tube - 10.03 lbs/ft
4" .375 wall tube - 14.55 lbs/ft

Using this calculator you can see that the 4" .25 wall tubing is virtually the same in strength as the 3.5 1/2" wall. If you step up to 3/8" it's ballgame.
https://www.easycalculation.com/mechanical/deflection-round-tube-beams.php
The nerds here will appreciate this info, the rest of you I can see are already shaking heads.

Anyway, here's the pics.

redneckengineered · Aug 24, 2016

Beerj · Aug 24, 2016

You didn't fill the diff up with fuses and random bolts? Wasted opportunity.

FlatlandFSJ · Aug 24, 2016

redneckengineered said:
4" tube drops panties.

For this reason alone...I ditched my sd60 chunk and picked up another 80 to build into my front. 14 bolts are the new 60s :flipoff1:

tallnate · Aug 24, 2016

So since that's a van 14 bolt it has the 10.5 ring gear and pinion support bearing correct? Or is that an AAM 11.5 without the support bearing?

redneckengineered · Aug 24, 2016

tallnate said:
So since that's a van 14 bolt it has the 10.5 ring gear and pinion support bearing correct? Or is that an AAM 11.5 without the support bearing?

Correct. AAM 11.5 doesn't look anything like this. I at first thought this was the AAM 11.5 based on the sheer size but after some research it's just a big ass 14 bolt.

patooyee · Aug 24, 2016

tallnate said:
So since that's a van 14 bolt it has the 10.5 ring gear and pinion support bearing correct? Or is that an AAM 11.5 without the support bearing?

That is a conventional 10.5" w/pinion support.

The new 14-bolt dif cover looks about as different from the old one as can be to me. Maybe people just aren't used to looking at them but, when you put them side by side, mistaking one for the other would be like mistaking a dana 44 for a 14-bolt.

Not picking on you specifically because I see people having to ask all the time in these threads. But they don't look anything alike IMHO.

Old Style 14-bolt:
https://www.ringpinion.com/b2c/DiffDetails.aspx?DiffID=196&SearchMode=Diff&TypeID=5

New Style 14-bolt that no one wants these days:
https://www.ringpinion.com/b2c/DiffDetails.aspx?DiffID=190&SearchMode=Diff&TypeID=5

redneckengineered · Aug 24, 2016

Looks like factory 1/2" wall tubes in case anyone was wondering.

tallnate · Aug 24, 2016

patooyee said:
That is a conventional 10.5" w/pinion support.

The new 14-bolt dif cover looks about as different from the old one as can be to me. Maybe people just aren't used to looking at them but, when you put them side by side, mistaking one for the other would be like mistaking a dana 44 for a 14-bolt.

Not picking on you specifically because I see people having to ask all the time in these threads. But they don't look anything alike IMHO.

Old Style 14-bolt:
https://www.ringpinion.com/b2c/DiffDetails.aspx?DiffID=196&SearchMode=Diff&TypeID=5

New Style 14-bolt that no one wants these days:
https://www.ringpinion.com/b2c/DiffDetails.aspx?DiffID=190&SearchMode=Diff&TypeID=5

Yeah good point. I didn't even think about the fact that the diff cover on the 10.5 is different than the 11.5. I need to start searching for one of the big block van axles myself.

patooyee · Aug 24, 2016

redneckengineered said:
Looks like factory 1/2" wall tubes in case anyone was wondering.

Almost a shame to be making that a front instead of a rear. How much did you pay for it, BTW?

redneckengineered · Aug 24, 2016

Unit bearings came in today. They are huge. That's starting to be a theme with this build. This is probably my first time ever handling a unit bearing so I have a lot of questions.

1) Obviously I don't need the ABS sensor. If you unbolt it, it leaves a nice hole in the side. What's the best thing to do here?
2) What do you run for caps to keep crap out of the inside? RCV sells caps for $125/ea which seems high for a couple caps.