Buggy Wiring Ideas

BamaTJ · Aug 4, 2008

I have a little issue with the electrical system in my buggy, also known as Christine. I believe we have narrowed it down to too much load on the cicruit, but here is what I am working with.

Components Using Power
Electric Water Pump
Electric Fan
Tranny Cooler Fan (on a thermostat, only comes on when hot)
Headlights
Rocklights
Fuel Pump
Winches
Gauge Lights

I have 3 relays and a single circuit breaker right now (unsure of the amperage rating on the breaker). Dollar thinks I just need to add an extra breaker and split up the load. There are currenlty 4 leads going to the breaker and one constant power. Here is the problem, when too many things are running and have been for a while (vehicle has been running for 15-20 minutes) things start to shut off. Water pump, lights and tranny fan are all tied together I know that much, I suspect the electric fan is the other. The vehicle never stops running, but all 3 items I just listed will cut off. Wheelin during the day I had no issues on Saturday because the tranny cooler never stayed on for more than 20 seconds. Every night when I added in the power from the headlights **** would cut off on a regular basis, especially when driven hard for a period of time.

Dollar suggested adding up the amp draw of all my components and trying to figure out the right number and type of circuit breakers to use. Any other help or ideas? Any guesses as to what my components would draw amp wise? Any dowside to just getting the highest amp breaker I can buy and daisy chaining it to what I have and splitting up the load?

InDaShop · Aug 4, 2008

Dollar be wise, SON!

You need to split the circuits. Not hard, just time consuming, but otherwise you'll continue to overload those wires.

Bones · Aug 4, 2008

water pump, fan and trans fan would all be on separate circuits if it were me. [Lights on another and fuel pump/misc on another.] - maybe these could all be on one??

The winch is going through a relay and not just straight to the battery?

BamaTJ · Aug 4, 2008

I don't think it should be hard either, the breakers (terminal style) and relays are mounted right next to each other under the cowl. I was thinking I could add another terminal style breaker there and just split up the wires from 4 to one to two and two. Probably would be a good idea to put the WP on a dedicated circuit since it is critical (Dollar's idea again). I can then make a jumper wire to connect the hot wire from the breaker I have now to the new breaker. What kind of amperage should I look at for the breakers?

Bones the winch is going directly to the battery as is the starter, you are right there. Is there a downside to just running the highest amperage breakers I can get? I don't really no much about wiring...

Jackstand Jimmy · Aug 4, 2008

Ideally you want the overload protector (either a circuit breaker or fuse) to be rated a little over what the devise they protect pulls. If your water pump pulls 40 amps then put a 50 amp fuse on it, if you have two headlights pulling 55 watts each then divide that by the voltage (12 of course), add a little for voltage drop in the wiring and put say a 15 amp fuse on it. If you only have 4 leads going coming from your existing circuit breaker you could split them all up and run 4 different CBs or fuses. On a buggy or other stripped down rig their really isn't any reason you can't run all the crucial stuff on their own circuit...cooling fans, fuel pump, lights, WP in your case, etc and then put the "extra" stuff all on one or two circuits...CB, gages, 12 outlets, rock lights, radio, etc.
as far as the wiring that feeds those circuit breakers or fuses, it just depends on how much is going thru them. Add up the ampage of everything they power and do a google search on wire size chart...match the ampage with the run of wire and it will tell you the size that you need.

Bones · Aug 4, 2008

The more you separate things, the easier it will be to diagnose when something fails also. Should also make it easier/faster to repair.

I hate wiring

BamaTJ · Aug 4, 2008

Jackstand Jimmy said:
Ideally you want the overload protector (either a circuit breaker or fuse) to be rated a little over what the devise they protect pulls. If your water pump pulls 40 amps then put a 50 amp fuse on it, if you have two headlights pulling 55 watts each then divide that by the voltage (12 of course), add a little for voltage drop in the wiring and put say a 15 amp fuse on it. If you only have 4 leads going coming from your existing circuit breaker you could split them all up and run 4 different CBs or fuses. On a buggy or other stripped down rig their really isn't any reason you can't run all the crucial stuff on their own circuit...cooling fans, fuel pump, lights, WP in your case, etc and then put the "extra" stuff all on one or two circuits...CB, gages, 12 outlets, rock lights, radio, etc.
as far as the wiring that feeds those circuit breakers or fuses, it just depends on how much is going thru them. Add up the ampage of everything they power and do a google search on wire size chart...match the ampage with the run of wire and it will tell you the size that you need.

Thanks Jimmy, that is exactly what I was looking for. I am going to search my components and find out the amp draw. I found the WP and it pulls 11-12 amps, so I was thinking a dedicated 20 amp fuse for that one. Not sure on the fans and cannot find any numbers to go buy.

Mr. Underkill · Aug 4, 2008

Components Using Power
Cir 1 - Electric Water Pump & Fuel pump. Do you want it running if the WP dies?
Cir 2 - Electric Fan & Trans fan
Cir 3 -Headlights, Rocklights, gauge lights
The breakler should be sized for the gauge wire your using on the circuit then the wire should be sized to the load. On my boats we use 150% of the load max for breakers.

I'd guess about 20A on the lights.
15-20A for the fans this includes startup load.
Don't know your pumps so I can't guess.

BamaTJ · Aug 4, 2008

SOme other things I found were the rock lights must be wired directly to the battery, because they never go off when the rest of it goes. The headlights and gauge lights are wired to the same switch, but only the headlights go out when it becomes Christine. I need to check the size of the breaker on it now and go from there.

The fuel pump is an E2000 it appears and then the WP pulls in 11-12 amps

Mr. Underkill · Aug 4, 2008

sounds like another 20A circuit for the pumps

do the head lights go dark, or glow dim?

BamaTJ · Aug 4, 2008

Mr. Underkill said:
sounds like another 20A circuit for the pumps

do the head lights go dark, or glow dim?

Headlights go dark and WP stops completely. Thought it was a heat issue at first, but went I took the tranny fan off of permanent run mode the problem stopped during the day. At night I added lights to the mix and the problem came back.

Mr. Underkill · Aug 4, 2008

Matt O. said:
Headlights go dark and WP stops completely. Thought it was a heat issue at first, but went I took the tranny fan off of permanent run mode the problem stopped during the day. At night I added lights to the mix and the problem came back.

when you took the load off the resulting devices started to work...sounds like too much voltage loss in the wire due to high load. Split the loads up. What gauge wire are you running for the WP and head lights? I'd think 14

BamaTJ · Aug 4, 2008

Not sure on wire gauge on those, I will have to look.

vanguard · Aug 4, 2008

I have this multimeter from radio shack: http://www.radioshack.com/pwr/product-reviews/Cables-Parts-Connectors/Test-measuring-equipment/Testers/RadioShack/p/2103173-Clamp-On-AC-Ammeter.html

It's different than most inexpensive multimeters in that it measure amp draw. I've found it handy *lots* of times while working on my house or rig to track down issues. If you can't look up the spec it's pretty easy to use it to measure the actual amp draw.

Cole · Aug 4, 2008

Ol' Christine sure did put on a Hell of a light show on little Jagger the other night :flipoff1:

Jackstand Jimmy · Aug 4, 2008

vanguard said:
I have this multimeter from radio shack: http://www.radioshack.com/pwr/product-reviews/Cables-Parts-Connectors/Test-measuring-equipment/Testers/RadioShack/p/2103173-Clamp-On-AC-Ammeter.html

It's different than most inexpensive multimeters in that it measure amp draw. I've found it handy *lots* of times while working on my house or rig to track down issues. If you can't look up the spec it's pretty easy to use it to measure the actual amp draw.

yep...a high range ampmeter is handy to have. I used to have an old analog ampmeter (the rectangular kind with the horizontal numbers) that I had salvaged out of the control board for some sort of industrial equipment a while ago. It was ghetto to see me use it but I could find the current draw for anything I wanted to up to 75 amps. I need to get a meter that has one...

BamaTJ · Aug 4, 2008

Cole said:
Ol' Christine sure did put on a Hell of a light show on little Jagger the other night

That is part of the deal, disco light effects are cool

87yjtoy · Aug 4, 2008

Matt you also need to seperate the power to the C/B. You can do that with a bus bar but I would be careful about just running a jumper wire between the C/Bs.
Make sure that the wire is big enough to supply all the power you need with out getting hot. May need 2 or 3 supply line to the C/Bs.

BamaTJ · Aug 4, 2008

87yjtoy said:
Matt you also need to seperate the power to the C/B. You can do that with a bus bar but I would be careful about just running a jumper wire between the C/Bs.
Make sure that the wire is big enough to supply all the power you need with out getting hot. May need 2 or 3 supply line to the C/Bs.

Pat so you are saying run a line from the CB to the battery for each CB I run?

87yjtoy · Aug 4, 2008

Yes either that or a large gage wire to a bus bar that feeds all the C/Bs. Just make sure that this feed wire can support all the amps of the C/Bs combined.