• Help Support Hardline Crawlers :

LLC or Sole Proprietor for rental property management?

TacomaJD

I LIKE CHEAP STUFF.....
Joined
Oct 28, 2010
Messages
14,441
Reaction score
13
Location
Rainsville, AL
If one is to begin a venture into owning rental properties, would you think forming an LLC would be worth the trouble and extra costs? Considering both options, a hefty umbrella liability policy will be carried regardless.

I understand that LLC's are usually formed to protect one's personal assets, but say I was to operate as a sole proprietor and carried a minimum of $1m umbrella policy on top of the liability coverage included with the standard insurance policy ($500k maybe?), wouldn't that sufficiently cover my ass enough without having to fawk with an LLC? Also, I would increase umbrella limit as assets increase too.

Hard to find a definitive answer on the matter on the web, so I figured I'd poll the great businessmen of Hardline.
 
Re:

No. LLC. First $2million dollar claim and you'll thank me from your house instead of a box.
 
Ok, I guess I need to read up on the benefits / differences between an LLC with 2 owners and a LLP owned by a married couple now - if there are any differences. Casie and I would definitely both be owners of said business, as most of the initial property belongs to her.

Seems as if common costs are around $1,000-$2,000 for a lawyer to handle the formation of your LLC, unless it's done via Legal Zoom, but it kinda seems like a complicated process, of which I am completely new to. I can usually figure things out if I study on them for a while, so maybe I could save a little money and figure out how to do it myself and thus gain valuable knowledge of the process to boot.

She inherited a few properties when her father passed, a trailer and a brick house both already occupied by tenants, then the brick house that she lived in with her father - which we will rent out along with my current house after we get moved into the new house next spring. I've been crunching all the info I can to learn the ins and outs of the business to make sure we handle all legal aspects of it correctly until we get completely comfortable with the business. The tenant in the brick house is a douche, probably about to have to drop $1500 or so for water damage / mold because of his dumb ass (long story), but we are going to try to get rid of him - as he is on month to month lease. Her dad didn't screen his renters too good, because this guy has a history of ****ing up places he rents. So we are getting broke in right, entering the business. Lol. Comes with the territory and is to be expected.

Despite what many on here have stated in other threads on the public board, I feel confident that this is a great way to build wealth. A friend of mine is a lawyer here in town and does rental properties on the side as well. I had lunch with him last week and he answered a ton of questions for me. He's had up to 25 rental properties going at once and is beginning to phase them out via land sale contracts (rent to own) or outright sales, since he is getting older. Most think of rental properties and think of the horror stories of bad tenants, but I firmly believe, and have been reassured by my lawyer friend, that most of that can be avoided by denying tenancy if the inquiring tenant does not meet stringent criteria. The math is there to prove a great return on investment, as far as I can see. There will be expenses, stress, and hard work as with any business, but I believe in the end it will be a success if managed properly. Once I am more familiar and things begin to run more smoothly, I may also look into flipping some properties as well. Several around my area have made a great living doing both.
 
LLC
Legal Zoom handles mostly everything. But you need to find a good accountant to help with the tax filings.
 
Re: Re: LLC or Sole Proprietor for rental property management?

InDaShop said:
LLC
Legal Zoom handles mostly everything. But you need to find a good accountant to help with the tax filings.
Ah, i read their guidelines for forming an LLC and I figured I was responsible for filing with the probate judge and secretary of state. If they handle most of it, that would be the way to go.

I am going to talk to the folks I use for tax service, they always handled everything for my parents before dad got out of the car business. Not sure if he is a CPA or not, but he's damn smart on tax prep. He's done it all his life and took over the tax business after his parents passed away years ago. I'm taking some Accounting courses in school and know a little about the process already. Maybe paired with quickbooks and my tax man, that might be sufficient, unless there's something else Im not aware of.
 
Re: Re: LLC or Sole Proprietor for rental property management?

TacomaJD said:
Ah, i read their guidelines for forming an LLC and I figured I was responsible for filing with the probate judge and secretary of state. If they handle most of it, that would be the way to go.

I am going to talk to the folks I use for tax service, they always handled everything for my parents before dad got out of the car business. Not sure if he is a CPA or not, but he's damn smart on tax prep. He's done it all his life and took over the tax business after his parents passed away years ago. I'm taking some Accounting courses in school and know a little about the process already. Maybe paired with quickbooks and my tax man, that might be sufficient, unless there's something else Im not aware of.

My only semi-dislike of Legal Zoom was that if you wanted to change anything in your paperwork they would recharge you. Somehow was able to get them to email me soft copies and have been golden since.
 
Re: Re: LLC or Sole Proprietor for rental property management?

InDaShop said:
My only semi-dislike of Legal Zoom was that if you wanted to change anything in your paperwork they would recharge you. Somehow was able to get them to email me soft copies and have been golden since.

I will definitely give Legal Zoom a shot first and see. The formation of the LLC would take place after we are married anyway, which won't be until April 29th of next year. Gonna be a crazy hectic year buying a house, moving, getting married, remodeling some of her current house as prep for rental, and kicking off property management business. Exciting and nerve racking all at the same time.

I'm sure there will be plenty questions pop up between then and now and will post here for you guys' opinions on the matter at hand, as I know you guys are much more knowledgable on this stuff than I currently am. :drinkers:
 
Jayzus! Sounds like Casie has everything to lose. She marrying you and you taking her property?! DAMN!

Thems jokes. Sounds like a great plan to me. Ya'll setting up for "soft" retirement! Once your incoming monies net your outgoing monies per month. you can retire. But you never really retire with this, even though it's a soft/passive job.
 
LandSpeeder said:
Jayzus! Sounds like Casie has everything to lose. She marrying you and you taking her property?! DAMN!

Thems jokes. Sounds like a great plan to me. Ya'll setting up for "soft" retirement! Once your incoming monies net your outgoing monies per month. you can retire. But you never really retire with this, even though it's a soft/passive job.

I don't know that I want to ever actually retire as in quit working completely, I enjoy working and progressing forward; however, I will want to work less and live very comfortably when I approach retirement age. That's a long way off though, so my mind will probably change multiple times by then. BUT, I always plan on working a full time job for insurance and 401k type retirement as primary income, but would love to own at least 10+ rental units one day too as supplemental income. Appreciable assets that pay good every month, especially after each property becomes paid off, sound like a great way to invest to me. I like tangible assets vs investments like IRA's and such. I only have a 401k account because my employer offers a good contribution matching plan.

My lawyer buddy told me a good story over lunch. He said there used to be this investment guy that would come by his law office often trying to get him to invest in an IRA and let this guy manage his investments. He always declined as not interested. One day, he'd had enough of being bothered and told the guy to go home and make a list of his assets and debt and that he would also do the same, then, if investment guy was doing financially better than him, he'd invest with him....investment guy never came back after that. LOL He said hell, if that guy was so good at managing investments and making money, he wouldn't be in here trying to get me to pay him to manage my money - he'd be sitting at home making his own money through his own investments. Haha I got a kick out of that one.

I have wanted to get into rental properties for a while now. It is very unfortunate that Casie lost her father, but she/we are very fortunate to have been given the opportunity of a headstart on the rental property business after the inevitable. She has been so stressed out having all this new responsibility dumped in her lap and I have had to step up and really do a lot to help her handle it all. It's been a cluster fawk for the past few months, but will smooth out eventually and I'm damn ready for it too.
 
TacomaJD said:
I have wanted to get into rental properties for a while now. It is very unfortunate that Casie lost her father, but she/we are very fortunate to have been given the opportunity of a headstart on the rental property business after the inevitable. She has been so stressed out having all this new responsibility dumped in her lap and I have had to step up and really do a lot to help her handle it all. It's been a cluster fawk for the past few months, but will smooth out eventually and I'm damn ready for it too.

good for you on this front. And good for her. I've been an adult longer than I was a child, but I've recently had to financially support my only living parent, my mother. I've never received anything from my dad. My mother will have more debt than have assets when she passes, so there's nothing to inherit there. And even still, all she has is junk, including her double wide trailer.
It does suck Casie lost her father. Truly sorry for her and you in that regard, but count your blessings greatly that he was fiscally responsible and left her assets and not debt.
 
LandSpeeder said:
good for you on this front. And good for her. I've been an adult longer than I was a child, but I've recently had to financially support my only living parent, my mother. I've never received anything from my dad. My mother will have more debt than have assets when she passes, so there's nothing to inherit there. And even still, all she has is junk, including her double wide trailer.
It does suck Casie lost her father. Truly sorry for her and you in that regard, but count your blessings greatly that he was fiscally responsible and left her assets and not debt.

Yep, he took care of his 3 kids well. He pretty much raised all 3 of them most of their life as a single parent (their mom sucks), chicken farmed, owned several rental properties, and did odd jobs like HVAC service. He was a jack of all trades and a damn hard worker, and she takes after him a lot. She worked 68 hours a few weeks ago. I hate like **** waking up early working 2nd shift, but I been getting up at 6am every morning on 4 and 5 hours of sleep to get her boy ready for school because she has to be at work at 6:30am, and she goes in at 3am a couple days a week working 12's too. We work good together helping each other out.

Eventually when the dust is settled and rental properties are going good, I want her to quit working and kinda be a stay at home mom but help maintain some of the rental property duties. This will give her the freedom to do more at home with her son and our kid(s) whenever we cross that bridge....and she can cook more for me ;D :rolf:
 
CPA question. Upon reading up on the benefits of hiring a CPA, it seems the most prominent benefit is knowing any and everything about your tax liabilities. Say I ended up hiring a good CPA, would I still have to pay my tax man to file my tax returns at the end of the year too, or is that something the CPA could handle, eliminating the need to pay my tax man anymore?

Edit: Below copied and pasted from my tax man's website, looks like he may be able to handle anything I will need handled.

?Employee Business Expense Organizer
?Stock Sale Organizer
?Sale of Home Organizer
?Self Employment Income and Expense Organizer
?Rental Income and Expense Organizer
?Partnership / LLC (1065) Organizer
?S-Corporation (1120S) Organizer
?Exempt Non-Profit Organizer
 
TacomaJD said:
CPA question. Upon reading up on the benefits of hiring a CPA, it seems the most prominent benefit is knowing any and everything about your tax liabilities. Say I ended up hiring a good CPA, would I still have to pay my tax man to file my tax returns at the end of the year too, or is that something the CPA could handle, eliminating the need to pay my tax man anymore?

I still pay for tax filing...my CPA does the filing. It saves money and they are good at answering all the questions on how to keep money out of the .gov's pocket and into mine.
 
Lost a rental trailer today! Shitbag tenant's ole lady burned that mother down last night. No insurance on it, total loss. But, it was junky as **** and was going to be replaced anyway. Really not much of a loss, it's just gonna cost us to have someone come clean it all up and haul the **** off. ****ing worthless whore - prime example of why you need to screen your renters. Can't prove she did it, but due to recent events, there is not a doubt in my mind that she did.

06520d2daee32b3470597b16d4bb2b19.jpg


fbed09b981d22c4a847d0ad8c7d0627d.jpg


Damn gas tank got hot!

20c445ef5fff881732dc1c1f5c8c7fc6.jpg


6392788a94b69d19110af05f01488e15.jpg
 
Re: Re: LLC or Sole Proprietor for rental property management?

blacksheep10 said:
So you scored a trampoline?
**** no man, we were actually gonna go get it and bring it home for her boy to play on, but a few hours after I took this picture, that crazy whore was seen back over there with some friends, swiftly taking it apart, throwing it in the truck, and leaving! Us and the police got there about 5 minutes after they left according to the neighbor. Lol. All we scored was a huge ****ing mess to clean up. We will clean the property up this fall/winter, and after we get moved into new house and settled next year, we'll buy a cheap, but in good shape trailer and put back on the property and rent it for $350-400 a month, depending on quality of said trailer.
 
Re: Re: LLC or Sole Proprietor for rental property management?

TacomaJD said:
**** no man, we were actually gonna go get it and bring it home for her boy to play on, but a few hours after I took this picture, that crazy whore was seen back over there with some friends, swiftly taking it apart, throwing it in the truck, and leaving! Us and the police got there about 5 minutes after they left according to the neighbor. Lol. All we scored was a huge ****ing mess to clean up. We will clean the property up this fall/winter, and after we get moved into new house and settled next year, we'll buy a cheap, but in good shape trailer and put back on the property and rent it for $350-400 a month, depending on quality of said trailer.
Probably better to let that one go. Hate to have a psycho meth head broad thinking you stole HER trampoline and coming to your house causing trouble.
 
Re: Re: LLC or Sole Proprietor for rental property management?

blacksheep10 said:
Probably better to let that one go. Hate to have a psycho meth head broad thinking you stole HER trampoline and coming to your house causing trouble.

That's what I told Casie, getting the trampoline was her idea lol. Probably saved some broken arm doctor bills too haha.
 
At least you did not get it town down, then she came and got it. Serious note, time to look at the insurance on others also.


Posted with my thumbs from Tapatalk.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top