Power steering pump options

[jccarter1]

Looking for info on power steering pumps I have looked a lot and have found lots of different opinions and not a lot of clear answers I have ls motor currently running a truck accessory bracket and a P pump and it let go this weekend it has been working fine for a year or so but it was a little slow at low rpm it was a 1 ton pump w/hydro boost
main questions I am looking for are
1) what is the best P pump if I was to upgrade to aftermarket setup (I have heard about people having problems out of PSC pumps is this rumor or true)
2) is there any other pumps that I could make work with the ls truck bracket (example using a high flow TC pump from grand Cherokee)
3) is there a stock P pump that I don't know about that will keep up better I have heard of a 185 pump but yet to find any way to aquire one of these pumps
4) if I stick with a P pump anyone know of a part number for a underdrive pulley or a pulley that has holes cut in it so I don't have to pull the pulley on the motor every time I have to change the pump bc it sucks pulling the pulley while in the jeep

 

[patooyee]

Looking for info on power steering pumps I have looked a lot and have found lots of different opinions and not a lot of clear answers I have ls motor currently running a truck accessory bracket and a P pump and it let go this weekend it has been working fine for a year or so but it was a little slow at low rpm it was a 1 ton pump w/hydro boost
main questions I am looking for are
1) what is the best P pump if I was to upgrade to aftermarket setup (I have heard about people having problems out of PSC pumps is this rumor or true)
2) is there any other pumps that I could make work with the ls truck bracket (example using a high flow TC pump from grand Cherokee)
3) is there a stock P pump that I don't know about that will keep up better I have heard of a 185 pump but yet to find any way to aquire one of these pumps
4) if I stick with a P pump anyone know of a part number for a underdrive pulley or a pulley that has holes cut in it so I don't have to pull the pulley on the motor every time I have to change the pump bc it sucks pulling the pulley while in the jeep

2) No other pump other than a P will fit your bracket. If you do want to run a CB, CBr, or TC you can get an accessory bracket off of a 2005 SSR or Trailblazer and it will fit the smaller pumps and leave your alternator where it is.
3) There is no way to get a 185 from a parts store any more. Even if you ask for an application that originally had a 185 you now get a 135 instead. If you turn in a 185 core you'll get a 135 in return and have lost your 185 permanently. PSC and all the others use 185's. Its the only way to get one now unless you call MM Knopf and order 185 internals and back plate and put them in a housing yourself. (They're about $40 but they hate selling them to individuals, will normally transfer you around or hang up on you until you give up instead.)
4) You want to spin the pump faster or slower? Slower is difficult. PSC probably has faster / smaller pulleys though.

 

[infamous1]

Re:

I am running a psc with a stock pulley in truck brackets on my 6.0 full hydro with a single ended ram and a big dual pass round cooler using Swepco 750 fluid pushing 43s. I killed three of the pumps like you have in less than a year with all types of synthetic fluids in them. They would start getting noisy and hard to turn at idle then get progressively worst. Been beating the shiat out of this PSC setup for over a year and it has been flawless. DISCLAIMER, This is my personal setup, your results may vary!!

Sent from my Z750C using Tapatalk

 

[patooyee]

Re:

I am running a psc with a stock pulley in truck brackets on my 6.0 full hydro with a single ended ram and a big dual pass round cooler using Swepco 750 fluid pushing 43s. I killed three of the pumps like you have in less than a year with all types of synthetic fluids in them. They would start getting noisy and hard to turn at idle then get progressively worst. Been beating the shiat out of this PSC setup for over a year and it has been flawless. DISCLAIMER, This is my personal setup, your results may vary!!

Sent from my Z750C using Tapatalk

Do you still have any of your dead pumps sitting around that you would be willing to send to me? I would pay for shipping. I want to get a hold of as many bad pumps as I can to see what is going on but so many people turn them in as cores it hard to get them.

 

[jccarter1]

If I order the internals for the p pump to make it a 185 is it as simple as rebuilding it and special tool required or any specs info also is a underdrive pulley worth the investment

 

[patooyee]

The rebuild is fairly simple, can be done with basic tools and a bench vise. A smaller pulley may help a little at idle. I would give the West Texas mods a try before anything else.

 

[lowbudgetjunk]

Hijack engaged. I have a Trail Gear TC style. I have the kit and brackets for a 22r and have a 3.4. Minus the new brackets and belt, is there anything else that is slipping my mind that will be needed?

 

[jccarter1]

My bad I forgot to mention I have done the West Texas mods of drilling out the orifice and removing some of the shims in the shim stack

 

[Neal3000]

PSC or Howe is worth the money. I've had nothing but great luck with psc products, one of my friends has had all kinds of issues, but psc backed their product up 100% and replaced parts/helped him till it was resolved.

 

[jccarter1]

So I decided to give psc a call and see what info they could give me they were very help full and honest about what they recommend the guy told me that with a 2.5 double ended ram he would put one of there regular pumps with it which is basically a 135 cc pump with the west Texas mods for better flow and pressure he said that the 185 would burn up bc not needing to move the large volume of fluid. Which in short means they recommend the same pump that I currently have (just with better internal parts I am assuming) another thing we talked about was the pulley he told me that LS motors rev so high that the stock pulley was the only option they didn't make a pulley that has holes cut in it to be able to get to the bolts with the pulley on the motor dose anyone know of a pulley that has a open face design?

 

[Trailabite]

So I decided to give psc a call and see what info they could give me they were very help full and honest about what they recommend the guy told me that with a 2.5 double ended ram he would put one of there regular pumps with it which is basically a 135 cc pump with the west Texas mods for better flow and pressure he said that the 185 would burn up bc not needing to move the large volume of fluid. Which in short means they recommend the same pump that I currently have (just with better internal parts I am assuming) another thing we talked about was the pulley he told me that LS motors rev so high that the stock pulley was the only option they didn't make a pulley that has holes cut in it to be able to get to the bolts with the pulley on the motor dose anyone know of a pulley that has a open face design?

Check out KRC:

http://www.krcpower.com/ecommerce/replacement-pulleys/aluminum-pump.asp

 

[zjtrey]

I went with KRC just last week on my transaxle build… I had a PSC pump that wouldn't keep up with my 11.2 PSC orbital..

I was a bit confused when i got the KRC pump and saw it was setup at the same flow and pressure the PSC "said" it was… night and day difference.. You don't have to get the blingy aluminum pump if you're willing to come up with a bracket.. there are OEM LS brackets that will work... my 3800 came with a CB pump and the KRC bolted right up with a little extra spacing for belt alignment..

Every time I've called PSC I left the conversation still confused and not sure that what i was getting was gonna fix the issue.. KRC asked a couple of questions and set me up right for basically the same cost as PSC and they are pretty close to me so shipping was fast..

they can also supply you with the correct pulley for your engine rpm range, their pulleys are splined so they are easy to remove later on..

The pulley on my 5.3 rig has holes in it… I've seen guys cut holes with hole saws for bolt access too…

 

[infamous1]

Re: Re:

Do you still have any of your dead pumps sitting around that you would be willing to send to me? I would pay for shipping. I want to get a hold of as many bad pumps as I can to see what is going on but so many people turn them in as cores it hard to get them.

Cored them out and actually cored the one that I replaced with the PSC so I would have a new trail spare. Basically the vanes were burnished and very blue from spinning them so fast and building heat I assume.

Sent from my Z750C using Tapatalk

 

[infamous1]

Re: Re: Power steering pump options

My bad I forgot to mention I have done the West Texas mods of drilling out the orifice and removing some of the shims in the shim stack

Yeah I done that to my last two pumps before the PSC.

Sent from my Z750C using Tapatalk

 

[bjeep]

So is the KRC a TC or CB pump?

 

[patooyee]

(just with better internal parts I am assuming)

The internals are no different as far as I have seen.

Cored them out and actually cored the one that I replaced with the PSC so I would have a new trail spare. Basically the vanes were burnished and very blue from spinning them so fast and building heat I assume.

Thanks, that helps some on its own.

So is the KRC a TC or CB pump?

KRC is the only one of the big aftermarket companies that makes their own housings. I don't know if they use Saginaw rotors and vanes or their own. I believe the iron body one with 3 bolt holes has the same bolt pattern as a TC or a CB though. If I ever do buy an aftermarket pump again it will be KRC.

 

[jccarter1]

I swear power steering pumps info is like some kinda vodoo Magic

Would changing over to a tc or cb pump be an upgrade over the p pump I want to fix this problem once and for all and if that style of pump would be better I would be fine changing brackets I found gm brackets for 90 bucks

 

[patooyee]

I swear power steering pumps info is like some kinda vodoo Magic

Would changing over to a tc or cb pump be an upgrade over the p pump I want to fix this problem once and for all and if that style of pump would be better I would be fine changing brackets I found gm brackets for 90 bucks

I don't look at any of the common pumps as upgrades to each other. I think there are issues with systems that can kill any pump and that any pump will survive in a system without issues for the most part. (I say for the most part because reman pumps are complete ****, you never know what you're going to get, and they have zero quality control. You can and will find any part inside any reman pump, whether it fits properly or not.)

In terms of physical displacement from most to least they go like this:

P185
P135
CBr
CB
TC

But the TC is the only one that uses bearings on both ends of the pump shaft whereas the rest only use a bushing on the front. That makes the TC by far the most robust pump of them all. But just because the rotor and vane are bigger in one doesn't mean you will get more out of it. They are limited greatly by the valving and any of the smaller pumps can be modified to put a lot more out than stock.

 

[zjtrey]

JJ- I should have taken pics of the pump, I will get some later this week. The cast iron one I got has 2 bolts that mount it. I thought that TC pumps had 3 bolt holes but maybe that varies by application

 

[patooyee]

JJ- I should have taken pics of the pump, I will get some later this week. The cast iron one I got has 2 bolts that mount it. I thought that TC pumps had 3 bolt holes but maybe that varies by application

Maybe the two bolt holes are spaced the same as the two opposing ones on a TC? I called up there a while back and asked this question and they confirmed that they were the same. I seem to recall they had 3 holes back then though so maybe they have changed the design since then.