Redneckengineered and pholman

Rich · May 11, 2017

While this forum is a place to share ideas and opinions, I think yours suck. If you've been allowed the privilege of an Easyliner, I expect more positive feedback about off-roading. There has been little activity here since John's departure. I hope this is still a place that special HL crawlers can air their differences. Sure would be nice to see you guys support SWFDA OR STFU. Thanks. :indianajones:

P · May 12, 2017

pholmann · May 12, 2017

Well Rich, You know opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one and everyone else's stinks. That being said I wheel a hell of a lot more than most folks on this board. Don't make the mistake of thinking I am in any way shape or form a keyboard wheeler. I respect your decision to support the SFWDA, but for you to ask me to share your opinion is flat out bullshit. I'm not a sheeple nor will I get on board with your way of thinking simply because you want me to. I posted that my questions were answered and I was sufficed with it. That was because the conversation had passed up my knowledge of their workings. I bowed out at that point. Do I support them. **** no. Do I give a damn if you do. Not at all. Notice I haven't posted a ****ing thing in that thread since. Now about my contribution to the board. I positively contribute to this board daily. I don't insight drama and bashing on folks. When I have an opinion, I state it, otherwise I usually try to diffuse situations. I challenge you to find any other non easyliner behavior in my posts. I cannot speak for Andrew, only he can. I've only met Andrew once or twice at AOP and he seems like a good dude. He has a strong opinion on this, and I respect that as well. This is what's wrong with the world today. Nobody is supposed to have a differing or opposing opinion. I am honestly a little perturbed that you would call me out like this and expect me to sway to your way of thinking. The SFWDA is not an active participant in this forum, therefore In my opinion I did not bash on or speak badly of one of our own. With all that being said, I hold no ill feelings over this. You feel strongly about something and I can respect that. I'd still have a beer with ya.

redneckengineered · May 12, 2017

Rich said:
While this forum is a place to share ideas and opinions, I think yours suck. If you've been allowed the privilege of an Easyliner, I expect more positive feedback about off-roading. There has been little activity here since John's departure. I hope this is still a place that special HL crawlers can air their differences. Sure would be nice to see you guys support SWFDA OR STFU. Thanks. :indianajones:

Seriously? Agree with my point of view or kick rocks. I don't think that's how HL works and if it does, then maybe I am in the wrong place.

First off I would like to basically second what pholmann said. Well done pholmann. I'll just add a few comments of my own. Obviously I am quite outspoken about Southern. But, feel free to go find where I have called another member out FOR supporting Southern. I'll save you the time, it hasn't happened. See, I don't give a rats ass if you write your kids out of your will and donate it all to SFWDA. I really don't. If it makes you feel good and you think your money is going to a good cause, then by god that's great. But, I am not some keyboard cowboy that just wants to talk ****. I have been trail riding for 20 years now and I've been dealing with SFWDA for 15 of them. So, I'm not just talking out of my ass jumping on bandwagons. You also probably do not know that I knew John fairly well, dating back to the 38 Special build back when Adam Woodlee was still building in his Dad's garage. He knew my stance on Southern and we used to laugh about it. Imagine that! Two people with differing opinions getting along. The last Dixie Run I went to (I think it was 2015 and I vowed never to go back, still pissed I gave them my money) John came over to me and joked that he was surprised to see me there. We had a good laugh about it then as well.

I like to think I represent Hardline AND Easyline as well as anyone. I am a die hard trail rider, I ride as much or more than anyone, I support the sport in my own ways, I am outspoken, and I don't take BS from anyone. Isn't that what this club/forum used to be about?

Rich · May 12, 2017

John and I experienced over 45 years of various types of off-roading. While I absolutely agree with your right to a different opinion, I don't beleive you have the right to misrepresent our group by stating your opinion as fact. This website's mission is to promote all forms of off-roading. I don't seek out threads about rock bouncing or rzrs to bash because I think they're pointless. Different strokes.... That's why I think you could have shared your opinions in one post rather than pile on. Lead, follow, or get out of the way.

redneckengineered · May 12, 2017

Rich said:
John and I experienced over 45 years of various types of off-roading. While I absolutely agree with your right to a different opinion, I don't beleive you have the right to misrepresent our group by stating your opinion as fact. This website's mission is to promote all forms of off-roading. I don't seek out threads about rock bouncing or rzrs to bash because I think they're pointless. Different strokes.... That's why I think you could have shared your opinions in one post rather than pile on. Lead, follow, or get out of the way.

While I'm humbled that you think my posts carry that much weight around here, do you actually think the grown men on this forum can't read my posts and make up their own minds about Southern or whatever else I'm posting about? If some slack jaw idiot posts up about how a Dana 44 is better than the 14 bolt I'm going to laugh and move on. The topic of SFWDA is something I am passionate about and have a lot of experience with. I shared my thoughts simple as that and based on most of the responses, I am not in the minority. It really didn't get out of hand until their clown ass director of public relations chimed in and started claiming credit for things he and the club never did. Now he's on Facebook posting "**** social media" in a publicly accessible post :****:

Is there a mission statement somewhere about this forum I missed about how we're supposed to support all forms of offroading whether we like it or not? Do we support downhill mountain biking now? It sounds to me like you're just mad that I'm not walking in lock step with your views. This is a discussion forum where people discuss things. Independent thinkers will take in all the info and make up their own minds.

pholmann · May 12, 2017

Andrew, I could not have said that better. Since when should we all have the same way of thinking? Isn't that called socialism or communism. What does being an easyliner have anything at all to do with a differing opinion about an organization that the forum is unofficially a part of. We have the right to be or not to be. Hardline Crawlers isn't a part as a whole. That is an individual decision. I respected John greatly. I only got to know him a short time before he was sick. I respected him as a person and as a business man. It's very obvious that SFWDA has become inadequate in many many ways. How are things to be repaired if they are never discussed? This is the second largest forum to my knowledge right behind pirate. Would this not be a place to discuss concerns and peoples perceptions of the SFWDA? Are we going to accept the fact they think like Dodge? **** em if they don't like it, they will join (buy our junk) anyway. Any organization that is not for profit should gladly post up full financials when asked. Especially when dealing with a pool of potential supporters. Does it cost us anything to be a member? Nope. Are membership dues how they raise the majority of their money? I doubt it. So why the **** wouldn't you post **** up? Some dipshit is going to post up untrue **** and your mad because we dispute it? Facts!!! Give the facts and be forthcoming with info. This secret society bullshit doesn't cut it. I am not going to go to walmart, hand the clerk a hundred dollar bill, and accept a buggy full/ half full of whatever the hell they felt like. No, I am going to be selective about where my money is going. Same ****. Itemized lists are in order to save any face at all on this forum.

Rich · May 12, 2017

Of the three options, get out of the way is totally acceptable. I think I have a grip on your opinion if you have nothing good to say, say nothing. I beleive this dead horse needs no more beating

redneckengineered · May 12, 2017

Rich said:
Of the three options, get out of the way is totally acceptable. I think I have a grip on your opinion if you have nothing good to say, say nothing. I beleive this dead horse needs no more beating

Sorry but that's not how I roll. Maybe Hardline isn't for you?

Given your age I must say the safe space mentality shown here is troubling.

Rich · May 12, 2017

You OBVIOUSLY don't know who I am. Maybe HL isn't for you. :woody:

I can fix this.

redneckengineered · May 12, 2017

I know who you are Ricky B's dad, and go for it maybe you have the clout around here to get me banned for stating an opinion. You can have you own nice little group think forum. Sad!

bbone · May 12, 2017

Alrighty guys. That's enough. Glad we all know where we stand. HL is ever evolving and we are better through good and bad.

Rich · May 12, 2017

You're still missing the point. It's not your opinion at all it's the back and forth bullshit. :****: This site, just like the club was founded on "NO RULES". While we've found the great majority of members like this. We've also found that some folks were also raised with no rules. These people simply don't know how to act in polite society. Sometimes we can impart wisdom sometimes not. I've tried to relate that the problem is the personal swipes and continued bs. Yeah I'm old, accurate enough. But I didn't get this way being stupid and hard headed. I'd love to argue with you more, but it's happy hour and it would have to be a different subject. Love to debate something new.

redneckengineered · May 12, 2017

Rich said:
You're still missing the point. It's not your opinion at all it's the back and forth bullshit. :****:

You mean kind of like starting a new thread in EL to bitch and moan after the old thread had all but run its course?

Rich said:
While this forum is a place to share ideas and opinions, I think yours suck.
support SWFDA OR STFU. Thanks.

Ok, got it Kim Jong Rich :rolf:

pholmann · May 12, 2017

Well we've all stated where we stand on this. Let's just agree to disagree. Rich, I don't know you and would still have a beer with you. I consider your son a friend and because of that I've played extra nice. I'm honestly not sure why I was called on this anyway, but that's cool. I will gladly listen to anyone's beef with me with the intent of squashing said beef. I hope to meet you on the trail sometime. Andrew I'll catch you at aop I'm sure. Peace out! ;D

InDaShop · Jun 4, 2017

A month late, and I would say with zero bias to any party involved. I dont think I've met any of the 3 of yall in person unless it was in Cali and I was drunk, so it doesnt count.
I read this thread in EL, and went and tracked down the SWFDA thread and wasted my life reading that.

So heres my unbiased 3rd party read:
Rich, I'm blown away by the attempt to use this board as leverage on anyone. You didnt cross the line, you completely jumped over it of how I've always read and operated on Hardline way back to 12 years ago.
For a grown ass man, I'm disappointed in the posturing in that thread and here in EL because people didnt support your effort.

Thats some bullshit,
X

Rich · Jun 5, 2017

Apparently my communication skills are poor. A difference of opinion is absolutely necessary with any group.
I heard dissenting opinions. I tried to change those opinions. Couldn't change those opinions. Accepted those opinions as someone else's.
The problem,as I see it, was piling on. That was unnecessary to continue to criticize a FREE program that seems to support all aspects of off-roading. While I fully support free speech. I don't have a problem speaking freely here with Easyliners.