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Sammi rear axle anti wrap question...

FireballXL5

FireballXL5

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461
Location
Monroe, WA
So... My sammi came with a uninstalled rear anti wrap bar... So... I'm trying to put it on!

http://www.lowrangeoffroad.com/inde...sion-parts/sky-bolt-on-traction-bar-3839.html

But... The damn slide is frozen! Been hitting it with anti seize... Heating it up with a blowtorch, beating on it with a sledge, sliding cheater bars through the hole and trying to twist... Almost everything I can think of short of destroying it while trying to 'fix' it...

Anyone have experience/knowledge with these things? Like, how long is the slip shaft... So I know how far to heat it... I've basically given in to standing it upright and hitting it with penetrating fluid every time I look at it... I would almost just install it and hope the weight/flex of the rig frees it up... Except its frozen with about a 10 degree twist to it... So I don't think I would be able to get the bolts through the bracketry... Or maybe just install it with the sleeve and no bushings for a run to break it free... Dunno... Thoughts?
 
Why does a sammy need an anti wrap bar? From the pics, it looks like it would bend just before where the short bar is attached. If you really do need a wrap bar, this is not a good design.
 
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Arent anti wrap bars suppose to be solid no slip in them? they arent like a driveshaft, mine is a solid piece the whole may and mounted with bushings on all points of attachment. Same with the ones you see on the Dodges for getting more power to the ground.

I may be wrong but i doubt it suppose to be a slip shaft at all
 
FireballXL5 said:
So... My sammi came with a uninstalled rear anti wrap bar... So... I'm trying to put it on!

http://www.lowrangeoffroad.com/inde...sion-parts/sky-bolt-on-traction-bar-3839.html

But... The damn slide is frozen! Been hitting it with anti seize... Heating it up with a blowtorch, beating on it with a sledge, sliding cheater bars through the hole and trying to twist... Almost everything I can think of short of destroying it while trying to 'fix' it...

Anyone have experience/knowledge with these things? Like, how long is the slip shaft... So I know how far to heat it... I've basically given in to standing it upright and hitting it with penetrating fluid every time I look at it... I would almost just install it and hope the weight/flex of the rig frees it up... Except its frozen with about a 10 degree twist to it... So I don't think I would be able to get the bolts through the bracketry... Or maybe just install it with the sleeve and no bushings for a run to break it free... Dunno... Thoughts?
Click to expand...

From your description of a 10 degree twist. If it has splines like a driveshaft then its not going to just come free with oil or heat since the splines are holding it in place(binding). You could try twisting is backwards to try and get the twist out of it and it "might" free up.
 
I assume it doesn't have splines or else it would limit flex a **** ton. I think it is just a tube slid into another tube. Is it bent at all?

Keep pumping grease through the zerk and use the hydraulic pressure to push it apart.
 
Those antiwrap bars use threads on the tube to allow for the rear axle articulation...Although it was a novel idea, the better, simpler way is doing a solid top bar with a shackle at the frame end...The loss of articulation is minimal from bushings, or one could run a heim at the top or bottom of the shackle...
 
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A friend helped me make an anti wrap bar that sounds like what you have. The bottom inside tube goes in to within about 4 or 5 inches of bottoming out if I recall. The first time out I noticed that my friend was wrong when he said it would not limit my travel.. It limited my drop on the side that the ladder bar was on.

The only time I ever had issues with axle wrap was on steep, usually loose climbs. (not trail steep, but play area steeeeep.) Also the only times I had axle wrap was when I was not articulating, just kind of straight up kinda stuff, so rather than going to a front shackle style ladder bar I came up with something that worked for me. I don't know if it has been done before, but I just added a little extra steel at the bottom of the rear mount in front of the axle, and slotted the bottom bolt hole about 3 inches or so. The bottom bolt rests at the back of the slot nearest the axle when level, or articulated up, but is alowed to pull out into the slot when the passenger/ladder bar side drops. With this the ladder bar works perfectly in normal hillclimb situations, but still has full flex.

As far as getting it unstuck just tie it to another rig, and hook your winch or strap to it, and pull. You may want to tie both sides together loosely so it doesn't come flying back at you.
 
I'll take a picture of mine and how its mounted for ya tomorrow Phil, it would be simple to make just need to be a bit smaller for you application
 
Oh hells yes! What the frick was I thinking? Using the winch is a perfect idea!

The reason it has a slip bar/tube is that it doesn't have a front shackle to help pivot the sway during articulation... It's hard bolted in the rear, and hard bolted up front... The long shaft slides, and the short half shaft pivots... I'm thinking I may pull the zirc also to relieve any air pressure as I pull it apart.. It has been off the rig at least the last two to three years... But everything is there to bolt it up... Already put on the rear bracketry... So as long as I can get the slide action smooth I'll be set!

At elbe, I saw all the sammi guys running a rear anti wrap bar of one kind or another... Thought I'd give it a shot since I got one with the truck. I can always remove it if I don't like it... I do currently get wheel hop/bounce when climbing on the rocks... Like at the Reiter rock pile... Doesn't happen always, just enough to want to do something about it...
 
FireballXL5 said:
Oh hells yes! What the frick was I thinking? Using the winch is a perfect idea!

The reason it has a slip bar/tube is that it doesn't have a front shackle to help pivot the sway during articulation... It's hard bolted in the rear, and hard bolted up front... The long shaft slides, and the short half shaft pivots... I'm thinking I may pull the zirc also to relieve any air pressure as I pull it apart.. It has been off the rig at least the last two to three years... But everything is there to bolt it up... Already put on the rear bracketry... So as long as I can get the slide action smooth I'll be set!

At elbe, I saw all the sammi guys running a rear anti wrap bar of one kind or another... Thought I'd give it a shot since I got one with the truck. I can always remove it if I don't like it... I do currently get wheel hop/bounce when climbing on the rocks... Like at the Reiter rock pile... Doesn't happen always, just enough to want to do something about it...
Click to expand...

Be very careful trying to pull that apart with a winch. Your going to have a tremendous amount of tension on your cable when it comes apart (if) your going to have a missile on your hands :eeek:
 
Just bolt the assembly on there, and figure out where the frame end ends up, and modify that end to accept a shackle setup, and weld that slip portion solid! I did the slip/twist version at one point, it worked, but it kinda sucked as it did hinder articulation...i'll grab a pic of it...Ironically, it's an articulation shot! :redneck: Look thru to the rear axle, and you can kinda see the antiwrap concoction! :D
 

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I'm gonna give it another try to get the slip free because it'll require the least bit of modification... And then I'll have something to base my later comparisons against...

Just curious... How did you incorporate the 'twist' factor into a welded setup on shackles? Would I need to alter the front mount to include some type of ball joint? I know all that stuff is out there... Just askin.

The front bar and bolt location is/was still on the truck when I crawled under there... So I know it'll all just bolt on if I can get the slip free... With how hard it IS stuck, I doubt just pumping it with fluid in the zirc would press it out.. Thinking ill just pull the zirc off, add some pull tension, hit it with penetrant and heat, then bang it with a bigger hammer! Hope it works... Then clean it up with sandpaper/wirebrush if necessary, and see if it helps how she crawls...
 
Grease will create a TREMENDOUS amt of pressure behind that; Might surprise ya... I ran a heim joint at the frame end....
 
Yay me! Broke it free! Had to heat it, lube it, stick a broken long side axle through it, and take the 4' handle off my 2 ton floor jack to use as a cheater bar! As soon as I heard the first POP from it letting loose and spinning 1 degree... I knew I had it.

Worked it back n forth with more lube until I could pull it apart. Then had to sand and file the dirtyness and burrs off it.. Now I'm filling it back up with fluid and gonna install it.
 
Front and rear are both solid mount... The offset for the rear axle is centered on the axle, and the main upper bar is in a slip joint... This allows compression/extension, while also allowing twist.

I may swap it out later for a shackle if I feel it's necessary/better, and then weld the slip joint solid. But, for the moment... This way keeps me on the trails without downtime.

In theory, it should work fine... Only the trails will tell!

And part of me wonders if having that solid bar parallel to the driveline could help me with rock slide/bottoming on the drive line...
 
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