very light weight coil over

billstoy · Jun 9, 2013

I'm running a 16" FOA coil over. I'm running a 18" X #100 bottom and a 10" X #80 and a 4" X #25 take up spring . They never bottom out! I had way to much body roll due to spring rates. I added a currie rock bar with their longest arms and lightest 36"swaybar . this has caused a much stiffer ride , and of coarse less body roll ! none of this was a surprise . I am happy but I would like to lighten the spring rate and make rock bar work harder to get a little more body roll/ spring flex but not as much as without rockbar! My buggy does so good but I would like a little more droop and flex , Even if i go to a shorter shock the spring rate and flex would be the same ! any ideas? ??? my buggy is a crawler not a racer ! no air bumps the fronts work well from full extension to full bottom out. I'm very happy with their rates. I have to say it is awesome to see 42's with one side at full extension and the other at full bottom and with the rock bar buggy will be nearly level! I love this stuff !! May be I could lengthen the arms but i'm not sure if I have room it's a tight little buggy.

RustyC · Jun 10, 2013

Turning down the o.d. of the swaybar is an option. This would allow the bar to have less effect even with the longest arms.
Have you tried to adjust where the dual rate slider stops? Getting on the lower(heavier) spring sooner could reduce some of the chassis roll.

patooyee · Jun 10, 2013

Sounds like your rig is super light. Have you messed with valving at all? I don't know what they valve c/o's for from the factory but it sure as **** wasn't right for my rig. I'm betting its not right for yours either.

billstoy · Jun 10, 2013

Thankyou both but It's not valving could have been But when building I knew it was light!!! Turning down the sway bay is a good idea! I had not thought of that.

billstoy · Jun 10, 2013

Im also looking for a little more droop

billstoy · Jun 10, 2013

i'm looking for a 12" or 14" 2.5" 60 pound spring, does any one make one that light ? or a 14 " total combination i have a tripple rate kit
I have a 10 80# 4" take up on top a 12 80# would not help me looking for more droop still open to ideas Thanks Rusty I can see you have more experience than me. I don't know much about adjusting the bottom spirng , But I do have the adjusters , I took them off for max flex !

wizzo · Jun 10, 2013

why could it not by valving? valving controls your shaft speed and reaction. all the coils really do is set ride height and you're already pretty damn light with the spring rates you currently have. also if you do have your dual rate adjusters removed you are risking damage to your upper springs. i think some pics of your setup would help alot.

patooyee · Jun 10, 2013

billstoy said:
Thankyou both but It's not valving could have been But when building I knew it was light!!! Turning down the sway bay is a good idea! I had not thought of that.

I'm not a shock expert. That's why I let people who are tell me what to do with my valving. But my rig was night and day difference both in stability and ride quality from stock valving to the first tune. It made the rig go from wholly unbearable to flog on to rides like a BMW when fully flogging and it only gets better with each subsequent re-valve. Based on this experience I would say that, if you haven't done anything with the valving so far, it probably IS your issue.

But someone has to make lighter springs. Desert buggies that weigh probably half of what you weigh run those same shocks and they are getting their springs from somewhere. That or they are running the springs you have and valving correctly.

Elliott · Jun 10, 2013

I can't imagine needing a spring that light, I'm betting Valving is your problem. But I don't run the adjusters either, I think its better to get your spring rates
Right and let them do their job.

Neal3000 · Jun 11, 2013

Read this and report back......also, why do you have such a short top spring?

ZukIzzy;14518668 said:
I will give these rules of thumb again. NONE of this is set in stone we will fudge it all from time to time but it is a good start.

lower spring 2" longer then shocl travel.
upper spring same as shock travel
try to keep the upper and lower springs within 100# of each other

2" to 3" of preload in the front.
2" of preload in the rear

your springs are too light if you have to use more preload to get ride height. and too heavy if you use less.

wayne

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/general-4x4-discussion/1074029-spring-tech-thread.html

billstoy · Jun 11, 2013

My comperssion and rebound it set by FOA for light in rear and med.light in the front the buggy rode perfect till I added the rock bar , when it distributes it's weight to both shocks at the same time in hard up and down reactions, it is to stiff ,not to slow or to fast as valving. Plus some of you missed I want 2 more inches of droop . as for the short top spring if I go to a 12 or 14 inch 80# this will raise my ride height ! that is why I need a taller lighter spring like a 14 60# .. Right now I'm thinking longer rock bar arms or turning down the sway bar from .750 to .650 for about 14% more flex. I love the rock bar but it is to stiff for such a light buggy and has removed more flex than I wanted.

billstoy · Jun 11, 2013

Hey guys play nice, even if I disagree, I welcome all input ! I'm running the lightest spring combo I can find. Hope to ride with some of you even take you for a ride with and without rock bar. I welcome the input.

Elliott · Jun 11, 2013

I guess I'm not understanding why you can't play with your spring rates and lengths enough so you could take the anti rock off?You should be able to stiffen it up enough to get rid of body roll and still flex well, the right Valving and spring rates work wonders.Where are you located at?

Travis · Jun 11, 2013

What do your springs measure at ride height?

billstoy · Jun 12, 2013

I'm near Ringgold ga. I will get some measurements , I'm still looking for more droop. I love the way the rock bar helps with wieght distribution ! When one tire drops out it transfers that weight to the tire with traction, This thing climbs 25 - 35 % better with the rock bar than it ever did, I rode for a year and a half before adding it, I have always been looking to get 2" more droop I'm shooting for 65-70% droop right now about 55-60% looking for a little more droop in rear for weight transfer to rear when climbing. front will unload, so I winch it down, I could add a pull down for the rear but that would stiffen the ride more . I could use a center limit strap.

Elliott · Jun 12, 2013

I'm totally lost on your percentages of droop. What are you basing this off of.

Neal3000 · Jun 12, 2013

I think maybe he wants less uptravel and more downtravel?

Again..... how much preload do you have, and how much shaft is showing at ride height?

billstoy · Jun 12, 2013

I'm looking for 4-5" up travel and 11-12 down . I'd like about 33% up and 66% down , also as much flex in my sway bar as possible and still control SOME body roll. Maybe I'm missleading everybody.
It does so good now , I'm down to just fine tunning ! I would like 1-2 " more droop ! and a little more travel/flex {15-25%} from my sway bar. The arms are at the longest setting,, can't not go longer on bar or arms. It's a toyota buggy all sprung wieght is up front, only weight on rear at rest, is me ,rear of cage, seat and fuel tank everything else is in front of me even the transfercase ends under my seat. very light on the ass till I turn it up hill, then she goes. I'm running 42 TSL s with 2# of air and still room to go down. I could move my front end 1-1 1/2" forward to help shift more weight to the rear. That won't help sway bar flex. I have been ridding my buggy for 2 years it is doing the best it ever has, always looking for a little more !!!

TacomaJD · Jun 13, 2013

Re: Re: Re: very light weight coil over

billstoy said:
I'm looking for 4-5" up travel and 11-12 down . I'd like about 33% up and 66% down , also as much flex in my sway bar as possible and still control SOME body roll. Maybe I'm missleading everybody.
It does so good now , I'm down to just fine tunning ! I would like 1-2 " more droop ! and a little more travel/flex {15-25%} from my sway bar. The arms are at the longest setting,, can't not go longer on bar or arms. It's a toyota buggy all sprung wieght is up front, only weight on rear at rest, is me ,rear of cage, seat and fuel tank everything else is in front of me even the transfercase ends under my seat. very light on the ass till I turn it up hill, then she goes. I'm running 42 TSL s with 2# of air and still room to go down. I could move my front end 1-1 1/2" forward to help shift more weight to the rear. That won't help sway bar flex. I have been ridding my buggy for 2 years it is doing the best it ever has, always looking for a little more !!!

33%+66% = 99% molaugh