What to do.

[Cole]

So I get an email from Woodlee today with the schedule for buggies and the new price to be on the waiting list. Here are the emails I got. This is not to leave this site. This sorta screws me with having to come up with so much to just be on a waiting list so early. Hell it will be this time next year before he can start it looks like.
I don't know what to do, I really like his work because it's different but damn I don't want to wait forever.
I should have just bought something already built.

We have room for two Turn Key projects at a time at Wide Open Design. This is the lay out of what the list looks like as of June 20, 2008. Most projects take around six months to complete.

Ron McRackin estimated completion 1-2 months
Donny Raughton estimated completion 2-4 months

Adam Woodlee

Steven O¢Neal

John Galbreath

Cole Shirley

Donny Raughton (2)

The way this will work out is When Ron McRakin¢s Jeep leaves then Adam Woodlee¢s Buggy will be started in its place.

Then when Donny Raughton¢s buggy leaves Steven O¢Neal¢s buggy will take its place.

When Adam Woodlee¢s buggy leaves then John Galbreath¢s buggy will take its place.

When Steven O¢Neal¢s buggy leaves Cole Shirley¢s buggy will take its place.

When John Galbrath¢s Buggy leaves then Donny Raughton¢s (2) buggy will take its place.

If you wish to keep your spot on the list pleas contact Wide Open Design and make arrangements to send a non refundable $5000 deposit by July 1st 2008. If you have not made arrangements by July first your spot will become available to other customers.

*******There has been some interest in buying Adam Woodlee¢s spot on this list. Contact me for details on the price. Please only serious inquiries. *******

The other email.
Wide Open Design is dedicated to building top of the line custom one off buggies. We build vehicles that are one off and what the customer wants. We use a different style of tube work on every rig so that none of them look the same. We also do some very trick sheet metal work that is apparent from both outside and inside the vehicle. Now with the amount of work and time that is involved in building custom rigs Wide Open Design has a waiting list for building a custom rig.

The way to secure a spot on the waiting list is to make a non refundable $5000 deposit to Wide Open Design. This deposit will go straight to the first down payment of the build when the project is started. This deposit is required because we schedule around our projects and to make estimates in our scheduling we need a strong commitment from our customers. This deposit guarantees your spot in the shop for when the next available spot opens up on the list. We make our best effort to let our customer know a time frame as to when projects will be started, but the project in front of your project is what will set the time frame for when your build will start. We won¢t start anther build until the one in front of it is done. Be sure and fully understand where you stand on the list when you send in your deposit.

 

[BamaTJ]

Well you know what Ricky will say

I think Adam is TOP NOTCH, but I think he is extremely over-committed right now and he charges a nice chunk of change to build a rig. I think his time tables are off because he has had ron's jeep since late last year so that puts it at 8-9 months. Ron's jeep had a lot of parts and pieces already, hell it was a running vehicle when he brought it there. I think that based on that schedule you would not be in a rig till the end of 2009. It is your call on how long you want to wait.

Jim's Garage was who I was going to use because he is the cheapest out there (10-12k labor and tube), is fast (4 months) and does really nice work. Plus he already knows how to build LIGHT comp style rigs. Adam has never done that, so it will be trail and error for him (not saying he can't do it cause I know he can). I don't think Jim is as good on the customer service and keeping you in the loop side as Adam is, so that is the tradeoff.

My thoughts

 

[Cole]

Yeah I have been swapping pm's with Jim this week. Will cost around 13k for everything including Powder Coat, with me supplying all the parts.
He is about 4 months out right now. The only thing with Jim is that most of his buggies are similiar and with Woodlee it would be something completely different. I am leaning toward Jims right now.

 

[BamaTJ]

I agree that Jim's buggies are more cookie cutter, but it is cheaper, less wait and in the end will be what you want and still built around YOU. Again I am not taking away from Woodlee by any means, I respect him and he and Bryan Cole both do insanely sick work. I believe they are good a building a certain type of rig, ie bigger, rock bouncing beasts with lots of tube and weight. They look different mainly because of the double frames and all the cage work, which all adds up to weight. I think with a small 2-seat comp buggy you can't really make it look completely unique without the extra tube work, unless you skin it out uniquely. In the end it is what YOU want. One off rig by Adam in 1.5+ years from now, or a more cookie-cutter type chassis by the end of 2008.

 

[Cole]

I have also had an offer from Daniel and Neal. They told me they would build me one all I had to do is buy them a good welder and a press so they could dimple die stuff. Of course I would have to supply all the parts and everything. It's a pretty temtping offer. I know they have the skills to do it. Just not sure if its worth all the Hell I would catch from them.

 

[Speeding]

Cole, if I were in your shoes, I would keep an eye on PBB and whatnot for a rig close to my likings. Buy it up and then send it to Adam for his "in and out" bay to redesign a few things. Wheelin' would be more important than having the perfect rig, I'd settle for mostly perfect. Also, I have a feeling you'll be waaay cheaper than a full build.

You're probably almost 2 years away from a rig from WOD, and one year from Jim's.

 

[Cole]

Cole, if I were in your shoes, I would keep an eye on PBB and whatnot for a rig close to my likings. Buy it up and then send it to Adam for his "in and out" bay to redesign a few things. Wheelin' would be more important than having the perfect rig, I'd settle for mostly perfect. Also, I have a feeling you'll be waaay cheaper than a full build.

You're probably almost 2 years away from a rig from WOD, and one year from Jim's.

Your right about being 2 years from Woodlee, but wrong about Jim. I could stand a year, it would help me financially.
I don't want to buy something then take it to woodlee. Hell I have almost everything I need already.

 

[BamaTJ]

If you bought a rig on PBB then you have to sell all those parts. 2 years is a long fawking time Cole, You could be in Jim's buggy by late this year, early next. I think that makes since if you want to wheel. Daniel and Neal would be a good option, but I see that taking a long ass time also.

 

[Cole]

If you bought a rig on PBB then you have to sell all those parts. 2 years is a long fawking time Cole, You could be in Jim's buggy by late this year, early next. I think that makes since if you want to wheel. Daniel and Neal would be a good option, but I see that taking a long ass time also.

I have pretty much ruled out Woodlee :'( sucks because a month ago I offered to pay him in full, it's between Jim and Daniel and Neal.
Also the only buggy I know I would buy right now is Jason Bergers old buggy and I can't find it. I thought I had the guys number who has it, called and left a message and never got a phone call.

I know Daniel and Neal have the skills to do it. I have them drawing me up a buggy right now just to see what they can come up with. I will also sit down and talk to them about it. I believe they could knock it out in around 4 months.
I would rather wait to the 1st of the year because then I could pretty much pay Cash for whatever I decide to do. Thats a huge factor.
Jim is booked for at least another 3-4 months so either way I go, I am going to have to wait.
Biggest thing with Daniel and Neal is I will get to see it being built, and will even get to work on it myself which would help me learn.

 

[P]

Buy a chassis from trentfab and finish it yourself.

 

[tonka toy]

i agree wiyh p buy a chasis and finish it your self . there is no way i would wait two years for woodlee it is not like you are going to show it you are going to beat the hell out of it. and i think the 5000 deposit is crazy it is a little early for that. he might be a little over comfident. if you think about it you are taking 20k to 40k worth of parts to him if you did not have the money when he was done he has a 60k rig for olny labor i would take that deal anyday but that is how i run my shop

 

[P]

Thing about the waiting.... seriously, whats/who is gonna be hot in 2 years ? Woodlee builds sick ****, no doubt no question. He is hot in the south at this moment and doing the right thing, getting it while he can all he can. Its smart business on his end.


The question is, do you just want Woodlee to build it because you want his name on it, or do you believe he is doing something that no one else is or can ??? I think we all know the answer to that. So , really what you gotta decide is if you want HIS name on your rig and if your willing to wait to get HIS name on your rig. Everything else is just compromise.

If I were in your shoes .... Id be lookin harder at Brian Cole than I would anyone else.... He started that double frame sick tube stuff, I think because he isnt interweb celeb or even online alot of people over look that. Every chassis Woodlee has built is the same double frame design that Brian Cole started doing on the FJ and Sami waaaaaay before Woodlee came along. The reseamblance on thier chassis layouts are so insanely close Im surprised they havent fought each other with their shirts off yet about it lolol

Do whats in your heart and get what you want, your commiting alot on this rig so make your decision and stick it out time is only part of what your getting into . I also dont know money difference between Brian and Woodlee, but damn they build about the same rig really...

 

[BamaTJ]

Nice post P, I agree with you 100%. Woodlee is benefiting right now from people trying to one up their friends. McCracken wants to hang with Uncle Bob, Steven O'Neal is just wasting more money on a buggy he will never wheel, only to say Woodlee built it. He will sell it in a year. The other kid has more money than sense, and is just blowing his inheritance out. I think John is the only one of the list that could truely benefit from an updated rig and will actually use it. His CJ has been wheeled hard for years and so will a buggy. I really think Woodlee is charging a pretty penny for his labor. I mean in the end he has built one full turn key buggy, several rigs with frames, but only one try ground up buggy. Both him and Brian do GREAT work, but I don't think either is worth a 2 year wait.

 

[Cole]

If I were in your shoes .... Id be lookin harder at Brian Cole than I would anyone else.... He started that double frame sick tube stuff, I think because he isnt interweb celeb or even online alot of people over look that. Every chassis Woodlee has built is the same double frame design that Brian Cole started doing on the FJ and Sami waaaaaay before Woodlee came along. The reseamblance on thier chassis layouts are so insanely close Im surprised they havent fought each other with their shirts off yet about it lolol

Do whats in your heart and get what you want, your commiting alot on this rig so make your decision and stick it out time is only part of what your getting into . I also dont know money difference between Brian and Woodlee, but damn they build about the same rig really...

Its funny you point out that there buggies look the same. They do have similiarities and yes Bryan was doing it before Woodlee. Biggest reason I wanted Woodlee to build it is because I knew it would be different than most buggies out there. I don't want double stacked frame or Double B. Pillars. I don't like that and I think its just extra weight. Bryan is booked up for a while also. Bryan get 20k for a buggy and Woodlee gets around 18k.

More than likely I will let Jim build it because I like his work and I want a small comp style buggy that weighs under 3500lbs. He has built a few of these so he has expericence and his price is pretty good.

Im just going to think about it for a little while and figure out what I want to do.

 

[Cole]

By the way, the information I have given out in this thread needs to stay in this thread.
Thanks

 

[P]

By the way, the information I have given out in this thread needs to stay in this thread.
Thanks

Its all been bench talked about but 10-fo regardless. ...


Just weigh all options is what I was getting at, find out what you are willing to compromise on and what your not and youll be happy as **** in the end lil buddy. Either way youll have a badass rig no matter what....

 

[Cole]

Talked to Woodlee and told him I was dropping off the list. He understood and it's all good.

On another note I talked to Dan at BTF, told him what I wanted and he seemed really interested. I am not sure if I can afford his work. He wants me to come up and check out the shop and maybe do some figuring on a Price. Anyone have a clue what he used to get for TurnKey stuff? He wouldn't really come out and say on the phone.
That would be nice since he is only 40 minutes away.

 

[P]

You never know man, he might be interested in working with you since your somewhat local, alot of people know you and who you are and you ride like ALOT . It would be putting his name and work out there , play that card and just talk with him. Never know he may do work for you! We all know his work is top notch and he has resource on everything go talk to the mayne.

Just dont do a cookie cutter jeep based rig man....

 

[BamaTJ]

Talked to Woodlee and told him I was dropping off the list. He understood and it's all good.

On another note I talked to Dan at BTF, told him what I wanted and he seemed really interested. I am not sure if I can afford his work. He wants me to come up and check out the shop and maybe do some figuring on a Price. Anyone have a clue what he used to get for TurnKey stuff? He wouldn't really come out and say on the phone.
That would be nice since he is only 40 minutes away.

Dan told me the other day that he has no interest or desire in building turn keys, he said it takes too long and costs the customer a ton of cash. He likes to build a roller with the suspension and drivetrain mounted and all the fab stuff done. You could go that route and have your ttown boys finish it out. I think Dan's train of thought is as follows, new location trying to get some local work in and out the door to compliment his healthy fabrication parts business. I mean I don't care what anyone says, the reason he moved here is to have access to more local customers. There is no market in Dothan for that ****. He went above and beyond to get my business, which is why my rig is there. He said he charges as much as $90/hr for fab work, but he is doing mine at $60 which is the same rate or less I would pay at ORC. Tan is tedius and meticulous with his work, you should see this trick brackets he cut on the table for mine. Most shops would of threw some mounts on and called it good. I like his attention to detail.

 

[P]

Matt did he estimate you a # of hours he'd have into yours ? Just curious what kinda quote you got... is yours still there ? i was going to go check it out today if I got a chance.