Coilover Spring Setup/tune

[zayne2427]

Re: Coil Spring Setup

From measurements according to accutune website.
Think the last measurement was 4 3/4 instead of 3 3/4

 

[zayne2427]

Re: Coil Spring Setup

Rear

 

[zayne2427]

Re: Coil Spring Setup

Sotting at Ride height
8" shaft in front
6" shaft rear
21.5" belly
118" wb
Upper link bars parallel to the ground

 

[zayne2427]

Re: Coil Spring Setup

Got a call from my buddy George over at Angry Fab and said he had some springs for me to use to tune with. Ill get them on this afternoon and report back.
Got 16" 150, 18" 200 for front
And 16" 100, 18" 150 for rear
Should be a good starting point

 

[TacomaJD]

Re:

That sounds pretty close to what I guessed. What motor is in it? Mine were 14" coilovers on the yota, 16" lower / 14" upper, started with 100/200, way too light. Ended up with 150/200 and it was still soft, but if I went with stiffer spring, it would have been sitting up too high in front. I had fixed bumps in front and it didn't take much to hit em hard if I slammed the front end down or hit a big bump fast. I adjusted the dual rate stop ring to where it would catch the heavy spring earlier on uptravel and it helped alot and still rode smooth on the top spring. You just have to play around with it once you get close with the springs.

 

[TacomaJD]

Re:

And that's why George is the **** in my book! He good ppl!

 

[zayne2427]

Re:

That sounds pretty close to what I guessed. What motor is in it? Mine were 14" coilovers on the yota, 16" lower / 14" upper, started with 100/200, way too light. Ended up with 150/200 and it was still soft, but if I went with stiffer spring, it would have been sitting up too high in front. I had fixed bumps in front and it didn't take much to hit em hard if I slammed the front end down or hit a big bump fast. I adjusted the dual rate stop ring to where it would catch the heavy spring earlier on uptravel and it helped alot and still rode smooth on the top spring. You just have to play around with it once you get close with the springs.

George let me borrow some springs
Fronts are 16"-150 over 18"200
Rears are. 16"-100 over 18" 150
Got them on yesterday and went and rode some private land.
Zero preload and ride height was still a little taller than planned but manageable
8.5" front shaft showing
7 3/4" rear shaft showing
22 3/4" belly height
With any preload on the uppers it would put me taller than I need to be
. Ride was 100% smoother than the heavy springs that were on it but the body roll is definitely something to get used to even with a rear sway bar. Need to recheck my nitrogen pressures and see if i can adjust height there some. Will try and get some better measurement this afternoon and get some opinions on getting this big ole girl dialed in a little better

 

[rpf500]

Re: Coil Spring Setup

If you can get your hands on a 18" x 200 lower I'd try that on the rear and see if that gives you more stability. I recently changed from a 200 to a 150 and it had a noticeable difference in body roll, meaning it had a lot more.


Where did you set dual rate slider ring? A lot of guys go for 1". If you are above that, try moving it down so your dual rate starts sooner to see if stability increases.

 

[zayne2427]

Re: Coil Spring Setup

If you can get your hands on a 18" x 200 lower I'd try that on the rear and see if that gives you more stability. I recently changed from a 200 to a 150 and it had a noticeable difference in body roll, meaning it had a lot more.


Where did you set dual rate slider ring? A lot of guys go for 1". If you are above that, try moving it down so your dual rate starts sooner to see if stability increases.

They were set at about 1"-1.5". I'll adjust them down below .5" and see if it helps and see if I can find a set of 18" 200 for the rear lowers

 

[halcat]

Re: Coil Spring Setup

That black rig on the first page is one good looking outfit!! But come on, late 90's , it was built in 06. Glad your getting your shocks worked out. I didn't have the patients to work it out. Love my ORI's though.

 

[kmcminn]

Re: Coil Spring Setup

There is a thousand different ways to skin a cat...

From what I have been told from 2 different shock gurus with proper setup you shouldnt need a sway bar. Whether that proper setup is link geometry or shock setup depends on your rig, especially on a trail rig. I think a sway bar can get you more to 100%. Use it to fine tune.

You will figure it out. Mine isnt perfect but if works great for me and it took lots of tinkering. But my front and rear links were setup by guys that are very knowledgeable. Mo did my front and Jimmy did my rear links. I just messed with the shocks and bumps. With the help of Alltech and a couple of guys i pmed on here.

 

[TacomaJD]

Re:

Dropping to a little lighter spring sounds like it would make body roll even worse, but that's not necessarily the case, as you will be able to preload then and by having a little lower ride height, the angles of your link bars may be better, making it more stable.

 

[zayne2427]

Re: Coil Spring Setup

Yeah I agree there are a 1000 different ways to skin a cat just trying to figure out a good way to skin mine. Lowering it 3.5 inches got my upper links almost parallel to the ground, much more stable amd less top heavy.
I agree that a sway bar is somewhat of a bandaid for a poor tuned suspension.
When I got this rig it was on air shocks, 25" belly height, and limit straps everywhere. I'm moving in the right direction just looking for some guidance from the guys that know much more about suspensions than I do. I appreciate all the help I've received so far

 

[TacomaJD]

Re:

After I got mine settled out, it was around 22" belly height (was at 24" prior). My wheelbase was 118.5", so damn near identical setup to yours. 22" was a good belly height for that long of wheel base. It sounds like you have got it close now though.

 

[zsavage81]

Re:

George let me borrow some springs
Fronts are 16"-150 over 18"200
Rears are. 16"-100 over 18" 150
Got them on yesterday and went and rode some private land.
Zero preload and ride height was still a little taller than planned but manageable
8.5" front shaft showing
7 3/4" rear shaft showing
22 3/4" belly height
With any preload on the uppers it would put me taller than I need to be
. Ride was 100% smoother than the heavy springs that were on it but the body roll is definitely something to get used to even with a rear sway bar. Need to recheck my nitrogen pressures and see if i can adjust height there some. Will try and get some better measurement this afternoon and get some opinions on getting this big ole girl dialed in a little better

You need to figure out your sprung corner weights, then you can figure out what spring rates you need. Having known spring rates allows you to do this easily.

First: Measure the springs fully extended with no pre load by running the top adjuster down to where it barely touches the spring (a 16" and 18" spring with the dual rate slider should be around 34.5").
Second: Drop it down so it's sitting under it's own weight and measure the springs again (example: mine compressed from 34.5 to 24 9/16")
Third: Do some math
(Tender Spring* Main Spring)/(tender spring+main spring), so for your front.... (150*200)/(150+200)=85.715 inch pounds
Calculate sprung corner weights by multiplying the number from above by the amount the springs compressed. Since I don't know this number for your buggy I'll use mine for example (34.5-24 9/16)*85.715=851.792#'s Do this for each corner and you'll know your exact sprung weights.

I also don't know how much shaft you want to show front and rear, but here's the formula once you decide that which will allow you to back into your spring rate's.
Shaft showing= Shock travel-((corner weight/initial spring rate)-Preload distance)


Also need to mention that I don't know ****, I subscribe to Wayne's tuning logic and base all my stuff of off of that!

 

[zayne2427]

Awesome thats what l was looking for. thanks ill do that tonight. i did notice that when i put the springs on at full droop my tender spring was still completely collapsed therefore not needing to adjust it down to contact the primary spring essentially acting as a small amout of preload on my primary's

 

[TRD]

That's good you're not using tender coils any more. I've actually seen the tender coils make the measurements difficult.

Tender coils are not desireable because they don't have enough force to push the axle down when drooping, and they don't provide significant traction when articulated.

 

[zayne2427]

That's good you're not using tender coils any more. I've actually seen the tender coils make the measurements difficult.

Tender coils are not desireable because they don't have enough force to push the axle down when drooping, and they don't provide significant traction when articulated.

they are still on there at this time, but are completely collapsed even at full droop with the current springs installed.

 

[TacomaJD]

Re:

Might as well take em off now, that's why you run the lower spring 2" longer. No longer a need for the triple rate tenders.

 

[zayne2427]

only way to get them off at this time is to cut them off as the threads on the shock body are all boogered up and cang get the dual rate stops off to get the tender coil off, but i will do that if it is what needs to be done