Down and Dirty Transaxle Build

zjtrey · Jan 23, 2015

my toys said:
Looks badass! I have been waiting to see a build thread on this since you showed me pics :****:
Keep us updated!

Thanks ben… hoping to bring this thing up your way later this year. I'll do my best to keep it updated

sleepsontoilet · Jan 23, 2015

I dig it, I'd love that motor in my Zuk. Did you happen to weigh it?

BNBOFFROAD · Jan 23, 2015

We're Hoping it will weigh around 3k.
We are finishing The front axle Up this weekend and next will be mounting the motor and transfer case
And then there's always :drinkers:

BNBOFFROAD · Jan 23, 2015

wizzo · Jan 24, 2015

What made you go with a chevy 60 front instead of something custom? 14 bolt or even hp 60 swapped to passenger side.

sleepsontoilet · Jan 24, 2015

BNBOFFROAD said:
We're Hoping it will weigh around 3k.

I meant the engine/trans.

Pearce97 · Jan 24, 2015

wizzo said:
What made you go with a chevy 60 front instead of something custom? 14 bolt or even hp 60 swapped to passenger side.

He's also shooting to be low budget where possible, yet still quality. Some of the parts were already on hand. And doing a great job of picking up parts for the right price.

zjtrey · Jan 24, 2015

I got the Chevy 60 cheap..

zjtrey · Jan 24, 2015

sleepsontoilet said:
I meant the engine/trans.

I haven't weighed it but most sources say they are in the 700lb range with fluids.

untchabl · Jan 24, 2015

Good to see another transaxle buggy being built. Yours is gonna have a bit more weepow than mine though. :driving:

my toys · Jan 25, 2015

zjtrey said:
Thanks ben… hoping to bring this thing up your way later this year. I'll do my best to keep it updated

Hope to get down your way too...

We are going to Harlan first weekend in October, would love to have you guys at that ride :woot:

patooyee · Jan 25, 2015

Not sure how much you've delved into the 4t65 but you picked a good transaxle there. There's like 12 final drive ratio combinations possible through the use of different carrier gears and chain sprockets. Since you're going to have a t-case my guess is that you'll be wanting one of the higher ratios. IIRC the highest final drive ratio possible is in the 2.5-2.75 range. Plus, its a really strong trans with tons of aftermarket support and there's about 20 of them in any given junkyard at any given time. Its probably the most common American FWD trans of all time. It can also be controlled full manual in stock form.

cumminsontherocks · Jan 25, 2015

Man this things coming out sick. Ive been gathering parts to finish up my sons honda buggy still.

zjtrey · Jan 25, 2015

thanks for the compliments :drinkers:

JJ- I did a fair amount of home work on transaxles and the 4t65e is pretty impressive for what it is.. I did read that you can control it electronically… tell me more.. is there a simple way?

The final drive gear set in this one is one of the lowest from what i've read… my plan for the transfer case is to use it as a doubler when applicable and keep it in high range most of the time. I should have around 60:1 in "high range" lol...

patooyee · Jan 25, 2015

Your shifts are controlled by solenoids a & b. I'm fairly certain all 4t65e's use the same shift control logic but if you give me the exact year, make and model of your donor I can make sure to post your exact logic. The GM performance build book explains how to simply wire up 2 toggle switches. Choosing which gear you are in is simply a matter of memorizing all 4 possible combinations of on / off for each one. BUT a really smart person could simply figure out a way to build some micro switches into a lever shifter that would work in the same way as the toggle switches. It would only take 2 micro switches and 4 5-pin relays.

If you leave the PC valve unhooked the trans defaults to full line pressure for shifts. I have heard that isn't half bad and for us it probably advantageous for trying to get to reverse quickly.

By eliminating the PC valve and the solenoid valve logic all that's left for the TCM to do is control TC lockup, which is a PWM valve. Its a special converter that allows gradual lockup based on pulse width supplied by the TCM without wearing out like a conventional converter would. You would have to look into that. You might be able to just wire that up on a switch also which would then eliminate the TCM entirely. In fact, now that I think about it, I want to say I have read about someone who did this.

zjtrey · Jan 25, 2015

its from a 2002 Pontiac bonneville ssei

BNBOFFROAD · Jan 25, 2015

Checking tire clearance at full stuff

patooyee · Jan 25, 2015

zjtrey said:
its from a 2002 Pontiac bonneville ssei

Gear - Solenoid A - Solenoid B
Park, Neutral, Rev. - On - On
1st - On - On
2nd - Off - On
3rd - Off - Off
4th - On - Off

So if you had 2 switches on the dash you would start off in first gear with both switches on. To shift to 2nd you would flip switch a off. #rd you would flip switch b off. 4th you would switch a back on.

I think P, N, R is determined by the states of other switches, like the brake switch and the manual position switch. Somewhere on youtube there is a video of a guy who put a 4l60 or 80 in his truck and eliminated the TCM doing all the stuff I've described. I'l try to find it and post it. The control systems are the same for both transmissions so it should all be the same.

Pearce97 · Jan 26, 2015

Not to hijack your thread Trey, but JJ, you can do that in the 4L60e also? I need to research that for sure.

patooyee · Jan 26, 2015

Pearce97 said:
Not to hijack your thread Trey, but JJ, you can do that in the 4L60e also? I need to research that for sure.

Yes. Most of GM's 4-speed electronic controlled transmissions all use the same or similar control solenoids, etc. They even used the same TCM's from generation to generation. If you look up part numbers for shift sol. a for a 4t40, 45, 4t65, 4l60, 4l80 many are the same part numbers. And if you look up the TCM's many are shared from generation to generation. And if they aren't the same part numbers the are basically the same anyway. They have different control logics sometimes. Depending on what software you are using to tune you can even change the control logic to use a truck TCM on a car trans or vice versa. There is a stand-alone trans controller made by TCI or some company made for the 4l60/80 that GM Performance used to control a performance version of their 4t65e in their 1000hp Ecotec drag car. The poitn of all fo this is just to sya that the TCMs may seem intimidating but at the transmission level its all just a bunch of solenoids and switches controlled by the same 12 volts as everything else. You can dumb it down or complicate as much as you want.

There is a guy on Pirate that sells shifters for the electronic Jeep transmissions. He's done exactly what I am describing. His shifter has mico switches built into it and he eliminates the TCM completely. At that point its just the shifter switching the solenoids on and off in the correct combinations.