If the State can't fund?

Ty. · Mar 8, 2011

Horus said:
Old Reiter was users paying for trails with the sweat on their brows and no help or funding from the state. Only when the state involved itself did the need for millions of dollars come into play.

I'm not looking for money, I'm looking for freedom.

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I love this quote.

Bill · Mar 8, 2011

it is sad when we have to go back to reality though.....public lands have rules

Money Mark · Mar 8, 2011

Horus....how did I ever doubt your logic.:worship: Please forgive us.....

Money Mark · Mar 8, 2011

Bill said:
it is sad when we have to go back to reality though.....public lands have rules with huge gray areas and not alot of (funding for) enforcemnt, aside from true issues

Fisked:awesomework:

If anything, over the past 12 months knee deep in the ins-and-outs of "this stuff", I KNOW those are facts. "I" might get caught, but "you" won't. :; And "getting caught" on DNR managed state lands is just formality. Only repeat offenders would be of any concern.

The WDFW could throw a wrench in this theory though.

Binder · Mar 8, 2011

Horus said:
The DNR is a government agency. It is owned by us to serve us, not oppress us. Taxpayers come first in America. Simple as that.

Not quite as simple as that.....You assume "taxpayers" describes our group of motorized users. Truth is "taxpayers" is everyone and motorized users are out voted a couple hunderd million to one.
Unfortunately the "taxpayers" have decided that the DNR's primary function isn't to provide us a place to play.:booo:

Bill · Mar 8, 2011

you mean it isn't an entitlement?

Binder · Mar 8, 2011

Money Mark said:
The WDFW could throw a wrench in this theory though.

So could the DNR. There's nothing stopping them from enforcing or not enforcing their own policies.:;

CHOP SHOP · Mar 8, 2011

Binder said:
Not quite as simple as that.....You assume "taxpayers" describes our group of motorized users. Truth is "taxpayers" is everyone and motorized users are out voted a couple hunderd million to one.
Unfortunately the "taxpayers" have decided that the DNR's primary function isn't to provide us a place to play.:booo:

I figure its a fair trade off. Some 4x4 using taxpayers are paying for a stadium too.

Binder · Mar 8, 2011

CHOP SHOP said:
I figure its a fair trade off. Some 4x4 using taxpayers are paying for a stadium too.

Now tell the truth, you're really into that stadium aren't you?........Nice avatar!:haha:

Money Mark · Mar 8, 2011

Binder said:
So could the DNR. There's nothing stopping them from enforcing or not enforcing their own policies.:;

Yes there is......$$$:; I know I don't have to convince you of this.

Let's break it down:

Ron (a DNR employed LEO) for 4 Counties, weekly visits to Reiter.

DNR David for the occasional weekday visit.

A local Sherriff able to respond to a 911 call (this is what a Trail Watch Volunteer would do)

The WDFW Officer(s).....how many will be on patrol and able to respond, if local at all?

The math in in favor of an unobvious wheeler looking to stay low-key and leave no trace.

CHOP SHOP · Mar 8, 2011

Binder said:
Nice avatar!:haha:

Shiat is A-OK!:bananadance:

Money Mark · Mar 8, 2011

Bill said:
you mean it isn't an entitlement?

It's an action with minimal consequences to the individual.

nate8887 · Mar 8, 2011

Money Mark said:
Yes there is......$$$:; I know I don't have to convince you of this.

Let's break it down:

Ron (a DNR employed LEO) for 4 Counties, weekly visits to Reiter.

DNR David for the occasional weekday visit.

A local Sherriff able to respond to a 911 call (this is what a Trail Watch Volunteer would do)

The WDFW Officer(s).....how many will be on patrol and able to respond, if local at all?

The math in in favor of an unobvious wheeler looking to stay low-key and leave no trace.

As long as his **** dont break

Binder · Mar 8, 2011

Money Mark said:
The math in in favor of an unobvious wheeler looking to stay low-key and leave no trace.

Yes I agree but that's not really what I meant. What I was getting at is the DNR has a soft policy to educate more than write citations. There's nothing holding them to this and being that they're reading all of this (Hi David) they know that many people intend to break the law knowing full well that they're in the wrong. What's the point of educationg someone who already knows what's up?
I see it being short order before they change their policy.

Money Mark · Mar 8, 2011

Binder said:
....and being that they're reading all of this (Hi David)

:haha:

I agree, they are not dumb. The DNR will protect their investment.

I await anxiously.....:corn:

Horus · Mar 8, 2011

Bill said:
it is sad when we have to go back to reality though.....public lands have rules

And those rules are a great example of our government over stepping its bounds. We do not want money. We do not want to in any way disrupt other people's lives. We do not leave anything man made on public lands we use nor take anything away from public lands when we leave. The trails ORV users make in the woods will disappear completely in a decade or less if left unused. We just want access to the public lands like everyone else and there is more than enough of it for everyone.

Keeping that in mind, what right do fellow taxpayers or The Government Of The People have to deny us that? Numbers are irrelevant when it comes to the preservation of individuals rights.

I make a living contributing to society and pay taxes for it. I want nothing in return other than access to public lands for motorized recreation. DNR kicked me out of Reiter.

If I were riding unemployment I could use a small part of that government check to buy hiking shoes. I did not need to buy ORV tabs for those hiking shoes either. DNR has not kicked me out of Reiter.

Jay Luke · Mar 8, 2011

Binder said:
they know that many people intend to break the law knowing full well that they're in the wrong. What's the point of educationg someone who already knows what's up?
I see it being short order before they change their policy.

This is an excellent point. And brings us back to the point I brought up. With the signs of "No Motor Vehicles" and keep outs...Where does that leave us. It's a real quagmire of ones own conscience, and willingness to break the law. Possibly suffer the questioning punishment. According to the signs, it's fines and possible jail time. That's what the DNR is holding over our heads. We basically have to take it in the ass. On all accounts. How can I get excited to help or support an institution like that?

Horus · Mar 8, 2011

Money Mark said:
Horus....how did I ever doubt your logic....

You've seen how I operate my rig?

:haha:

Bill · Mar 8, 2011

Horus said:
And those rules are a great example of our government over stepping its bounds. We do not want money. We do not want to in any way disrupt other people's lives. We do not leave anything man made on public lands we use nor take anything away from public lands when we leave. The trails ORV users make in the woods will disappear completely in a decade or less if left unused. We just want access to the public lands like everyone else and there is more than enough of it for everyone.

Keeping that in mind, what right do fellow taxpayers or The Government Of The People have to deny us that? Numbers are irrelevant when it comes to the preservation of individuals rights.

I make a living contributing to society and pay taxes for it. I want nothing in return other than access to public lands for motorized recreation. DNR kicked me out of Reiter.

If I were riding unemployment I could use a small part of that government check to buy hiking shoes. I did not need to buy ORV tabs for those hiking shoes either. DNR has not kicked me out of Reiter.

I understand all this BUT there is still all those pesky rules our elected officials put into place...who are we to ignore the law....