pholmann
Well-Known Member
Yup, ford HEI distributor is about 100$ or so isn't it?
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Help Support Hardline Crawlers :
Tech: At wits end with an overheating motor, long post
- Thread starter customcj7
- Start date
customcj7
Well-Known Member
Zjman said:
**** if I can remember how to setup points properly. Probably why I left it alone for so long.
84mallcrawl said:
Got lucky, it's not a reverse rotation engine. Confirmed. Crank turns clockwise.
pholmann said:
God I'd be pissed to spend $250 on the Petronix Ignitor and new coil only to have to buy another dizzy. But at this point, I'm willing to try anything. But since my motor didn't have a vacuum advance dizzy before, would that matter? I wouldn't think so, but hell if I know what I'm doing at this point.
LightBnDr said:
Welcome to the club, I've got jackets.
zukimaster
Hold my beer and watch this!
Maybe it's just trying to commit suicide, after all it is a Ford! :****:
customcj7
Well-Known Member
Okay, progress, small, but progress. Looks like GRCthird was onto something. So I found TDC on my setup and it's still TDC on my harmonic balancer, so I was dialed in correctly.
No play in the timing chain, nice and tight and moved at the slightest turn of the crank. So I had my timing at 10 BTDC. Well I pushed it out to 20 degrees BTDC and it ran like that for quite some time maxing out at 180 degrees. Only when I started backing it down closer to 10 degrees BTDC did it start to creep up. I was running into some stumbles and rough running which in my opinion is just the carb being way out of whack. I've tweaked and turned the damn thing so much there is no telling what I've got it set at. But the motor ran well.
When I was tweaking the carb I had the air cleaner off and could notice the difference on the sound from the bowls when I backed it back down to 10 degrees BTDC. It was much louder noise coming from the carb, honestly like exhaust noise. I'd adjust the timing back up to 20 degrees BTDC and the sound went away. I'd rev the motor and I got no pings or knocks. If I gassed it, it would jump right up no issue, if I slow rolled it up it stumbled and hesitated, which again, leads me to carb.
But it ran much cooler initially. So based on the stuff today, it sounds like first i need to get my carb better dialed in just for smooth consistency, and then I'm going to have to play with my timing to get the best run without pre-ignition and see how that holds up on the street.
Making major progress to not have it hit 200 today just idling. Plus my IR Thermometer was getting much cooler readings across the engine, and the exhaust manifolds. So it sounds like I was WAY retarded on my timing. By about 10-15 degrees depending on how it finally shapes out.
No play in the timing chain, nice and tight and moved at the slightest turn of the crank. So I had my timing at 10 BTDC. Well I pushed it out to 20 degrees BTDC and it ran like that for quite some time maxing out at 180 degrees. Only when I started backing it down closer to 10 degrees BTDC did it start to creep up. I was running into some stumbles and rough running which in my opinion is just the carb being way out of whack. I've tweaked and turned the damn thing so much there is no telling what I've got it set at. But the motor ran well.
When I was tweaking the carb I had the air cleaner off and could notice the difference on the sound from the bowls when I backed it back down to 10 degrees BTDC. It was much louder noise coming from the carb, honestly like exhaust noise. I'd adjust the timing back up to 20 degrees BTDC and the sound went away. I'd rev the motor and I got no pings or knocks. If I gassed it, it would jump right up no issue, if I slow rolled it up it stumbled and hesitated, which again, leads me to carb.
But it ran much cooler initially. So based on the stuff today, it sounds like first i need to get my carb better dialed in just for smooth consistency, and then I'm going to have to play with my timing to get the best run without pre-ignition and see how that holds up on the street.
Making major progress to not have it hit 200 today just idling. Plus my IR Thermometer was getting much cooler readings across the engine, and the exhaust manifolds. So it sounds like I was WAY retarded on my timing. By about 10-15 degrees depending on how it finally shapes out.
pholmann
Well-Known Member
What's a carburetor? 
;D
;D
customcj7
Well-Known Member
pholmann said:What's a carburetor?
A pain in my ass apparently. Damn Edelbrocks
UPDATE: So after advancing the timing way more than I would have felt comfortable doing, I have made serious progress. Engine will run for a long time at 180. I took it for a drive yesterday and only after a while did it get up to 210. But then it started sputtering out, and eventually dying. I think that is 100% carb fuel related. Still trying to dial in the carb without drowning it. I think it was too lean and was starving out unless I opened up the throttle, which would explain why it got to 210.
All in all, I think I have the major problem corrected. The timing was so retarded I was just cooking it with exhaust gas temps. A big thanks to GRCthird for telling me about the Petronix timing issues. Thanks to all those who helped. This Edelbrock carb is a pain in the ass compared to my old Holley so it may be time to switch back. I don't feel like fuel injection just because it's more than I want to invest right now.
redneckengineered
Trailer Park Panty Dropper
Zjman
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2014
- Messages
- 2,341
I swapped my Windsor over to stock 5.0 mustang injection this winter. 351 truck lower, Bc bronco adapter and rest car stuff. Really easy to do and not real expensive and man what a world of difference in power
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grcthird
Birmingham, AL
Sheesh the main thing comes to mind is granted a huge fault of mine and my way of thinking.
That is that for some reason I think if I haven't seen a problem or had to repair a problem before, it's just not a real problem. Lol
So my knee jerk reaction to help someone is based on whether in my 11yrs of being a technician have I seen it or not.
I don't know if it's that I attack problems differently than most so I just work through it quickly and don't even pay attention to those little things or what?
All in all I have built and worked on all makes and models. I have done a handful of pertronix points replacements especially 8-10yrs ago.
I have just never seen a motor retarded to the point of needing hospital care that it didn't fall on it's face truly. Where the first concern is it feels like a lawn mower from a dead stop.
So how in the world your timing was so particular that it made your motor over heat yet would run 12s in the quarter mile just blows my mind.
Hopefully you will be able to really find the issue and solve it for good. I'm just a skeptic I guess.
Again it's a fault of mine thinking if I have never had to fix it it doesn't really exist. Lol
That is that for some reason I think if I haven't seen a problem or had to repair a problem before, it's just not a real problem. Lol
So my knee jerk reaction to help someone is based on whether in my 11yrs of being a technician have I seen it or not.
I don't know if it's that I attack problems differently than most so I just work through it quickly and don't even pay attention to those little things or what?
All in all I have built and worked on all makes and models. I have done a handful of pertronix points replacements especially 8-10yrs ago.
I have just never seen a motor retarded to the point of needing hospital care that it didn't fall on it's face truly. Where the first concern is it feels like a lawn mower from a dead stop.
So how in the world your timing was so particular that it made your motor over heat yet would run 12s in the quarter mile just blows my mind.
Hopefully you will be able to really find the issue and solve it for good. I'm just a skeptic I guess.
Again it's a fault of mine thinking if I have never had to fix it it doesn't really exist. Lol
customcj7
Well-Known Member
LightBnDr said:
Well that could be part of the problem. When it would overheat in a few minutes, this was all sitting in the garage. There was no chance I was going to road test it when it overheated so fast. So I never really got to see how it truly ran under load. It was only revving the engine to about 3500-4000rpm. And what I thought was the carb giving me issues when I did it could have easily been it falling on it's face. There are so many items that were upgraded and changed with this tune-up that it's really hard to pinpoint one or the other, thus my problem.
And it sure as hell won't run a 12s quater mile on a good day, more like 30s quarter mile.
And I sure don't know what is up with the timing issue, but I only changed the timing and I saw a huge temp difference on the last "tweak". Gotta be something funky in there. Hell if I know for sure.
tall boy
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jul 2, 2008
- Messages
- 216
I fought overheating in my CJ7 when I went to my 401 from a 360. I tried everything. Took it a bunch of shops. I put 3 different radiators in it. Never could figure it out. Finally I called Ron Davis radiators. They flat would not sell me a radiator that would fit in the factory location. I begged. They said it was too small to run 2 fans. Finally I agreed to cut the hell out of my grill to fit a bigger one.
It has only overheated a couple of times now when my kids hit the switch to turn the fans off(yes I'm a dumb ass for having a switch). Other than that I had to put a thermostat on one of the fans so it would get warm enough for the fuel injection to work well.
Id say its your radiator is too small...
It has only overheated a couple of times now when my kids hit the switch to turn the fans off(yes I'm a dumb ass for having a switch). Other than that I had to put a thermostat on one of the fans so it would get warm enough for the fuel injection to work well.
Id say its your radiator is too small...
customcj7
Well-Known Member
UPDATE:
So long story short, I've got this thing almost dead on 160 +/- 10 degrees. And that was in 89 degree heat with hot as hell heat index.
Some additional things I've figured out. The timing was a big factor, but the biggest surprise was the gauge. I took someone's advice here and picked up a mechanical gauge for $20 from O'reillys. After all the work I had done I started getting 250 readings on the gauge. I had driven it and zero issues. So I first tested the mechanical. In boiling water with some heat loss from container transfer the mechanical read 190 degrees, fairly close to accurate. I put it in the block and ran the thing. After driving for 20 minutes, it was barely above 150 degrees. I parked it let it heat soak with no fans on or anything for 10 minutes. Gauge went up to 190 and then stayed there the whole way home. The damn gauge, mother effer.
Now I will say my timing adjustment has cured the backfires and made it easy as hell to start. She's tuned in now so it's running great. And it seems all my money put into cooling has worked, she stays very cool in the summer heat compared to before.
Drove the old girl to work today (64 degrees out) and it barely got above 150 degrees. Might have to change the T-stat to a 180 come winter time or else my heater won't work for squat and the old girl may not warm up.
Again, big thanks to everyone, you guys solved my issues. (with the jeep at least laughing1)
So long story short, I've got this thing almost dead on 160 +/- 10 degrees. And that was in 89 degree heat with hot as hell heat index.
Some additional things I've figured out. The timing was a big factor, but the biggest surprise was the gauge. I took someone's advice here and picked up a mechanical gauge for $20 from O'reillys. After all the work I had done I started getting 250 readings on the gauge. I had driven it and zero issues. So I first tested the mechanical. In boiling water with some heat loss from container transfer the mechanical read 190 degrees, fairly close to accurate. I put it in the block and ran the thing. After driving for 20 minutes, it was barely above 150 degrees. I parked it let it heat soak with no fans on or anything for 10 minutes. Gauge went up to 190 and then stayed there the whole way home. The damn gauge, mother effer.
Now I will say my timing adjustment has cured the backfires and made it easy as hell to start. She's tuned in now so it's running great. And it seems all my money put into cooling has worked, she stays very cool in the summer heat compared to before.
Drove the old girl to work today (64 degrees out) and it barely got above 150 degrees. Might have to change the T-stat to a 180 come winter time or else my heater won't work for squat and the old girl may not warm up.
Again, big thanks to everyone, you guys solved my issues. (with the jeep at least laughing1)
blacksheep10
XBJRA champ/ 555 and team Nasty codriver
more foolproof anyway, we had a loose ground on an electric gauge take us out of KOH. It was running HOT and losing oil pressure. I should have called BS on gauges but didn't want Wyatt to ruin a motor so we were in scramble mode trying to figure out the heating issue. ****ing loose ground in dashZjman said:
TBItoy
Well-Known Member
LightBnDr said:
Try 1st reply to the thread.
OP Glad you got it fixed, **** like that is mind numbing and extremely frustrating at the same time!
customcj7
Well-Known Member
TBItoy said:Try 1st reply to the thread.
OP Glad you got it fixed, **** like that is mind numbing and extremely frustrating at the same time!
Yeah I went back and looked and thought to myself, I'm definitely catching **** for this. laughing1
