Ultra4 vs Rockbouncer Shootout

Elliott · Apr 7, 2014

I know he put a mud truck case in blue, but aren't they offset on the outputs like the big case,I guess what im asking is It looks like the same rear axle how did he run the driveshaft?

Cole · Apr 7, 2014

Elliott said:
I know he put a mud truck case in blue, but aren't they offset on the outputs like the big case,I guess what im asking is It looks like the same rear axle how did he run the driveshaft?

Its a little case, it isn't like you see in all the big trucks or like what TC and Peter ran. Same rear axle as before

Mortalis5509 · Apr 7, 2014

Neal3000 said:
I can see prep time making a big difference in helping you finish the race but not in actual performance during the race if nothing breaks.

What kind of money do the top bouncer rigs have in them? Seems like you can get a top notch straight axle ultra4 car (like Will Carters) for around 100k

Personally i Believe the big difference is the amount of time put into shock tuning and researched and engineered suspension setups.

We already know that a ultra4 car can do all the top climbs, Peter Basler proved that.

They need to make the climbs harder in these shootouts, put some big stuff in that will be hard to do with 39" tires

It suspension and shocks for the U4 rig. They plant and go which creates stability and traction.

For a bouncer, they literately bounce. They spend a lot of time in the air going no where, not as stable due to being all over the place. I have seen some bouncers have short arms which would seem like it would create leverage.

Both have power, no doubt there. I think u4 cars put the power to the ground in a more effective manner. Rig prep and seat time make a huge difference in the end.

redbarron · Apr 7, 2014

Ultra4 vs Rockbouncer Shootout

I am certainly not an expert on either, but I would say the difference in tires is helping as well. Eric Miller came over and talked with us, he said he was running 20psi of air in his tires. I don't know what the rock bouncers run in theirs(I assume less than 20psi )but the SX seem to be compounding the bouncing. I am not trying to start an interco vs every other tire debate. Just my observation. I could be dead wrong as a am just an old school crawler. I ran 15psi in my red label and they seemed to have much less deflection than the LTB's I had to run at 5 psi. He also said they tear the car down after every race and had 40 hrs in tuning the shocks alone.

Mortalis5509 · Apr 7, 2014

redbarron said:
I am certainly not an expert on either, but I would say the difference in tires is helping as well. Eric Miller came over and talked with us, he said he was running 20psi of air in his tires. I don't know what the rock bouncers run in theirs(I assume less than 20psi )but the SX seem to be compounding the bouncing. I am not trying to start an interco vs every other tire debate. Just my observation. I could be dead wrong as a am just an old school crawler. I ran 15psi in my red label and they seemed to have much less deflection than the LTB's I had to run at 5 psi. He also said they tear the car down after every race and had 40 hrs in tuning the shocks alone.

Aren't swampers know to have a tough sidewall and therefore less flex, and like you stated more rebound due to those factors.

bigdude · Apr 7, 2014

Cole said:
383 stroker, th400, straight drive, 14 bolts, front axle has Ouverson Knuckles and C's with 40 spline RCV inners and 47 stubs I believe and rear is a stock 14 bolt with rcv axle shafts.

How much if any 0.25 wall is in the chassis? As many times as I have seen it beat on and rolled I don't remember a single tube, mounting point, or chassis failure

patooyee · Apr 7, 2014

bigdude said:
How much if any 0.25 wall is in the chassis? As many times as I have seen it beat on and rolled I don't remember a single tube, mounting point, or chassis failure

He ripped off both left frame link mounts in one video I saw. And a ton of tube work had to be redone after his hard hit at GAP I'm sure.

I was a little surprised at the link mounts ripping off but it was a pretty standard chassis design that is completely reliable for every other rig out there. I think he was just finding the outer fringe limits. And the hit was insanely violent. I don't know any rigs that wouldn't have needed major surgery after either of those events.

But I agree that chassis seems to be holding up really well for the violence it is put through. Hell, HE seems to be holding up really well. I'm still feeling lingering effects of some past hits and I'm not nearly as violent as him.

xjpaddler · Apr 7, 2014

Tunning, tunning and more tunning!!!! Even the bouncers with the triple bypass and coil overs are not as smooth as the u4 rigs. At the same time they dont have the hours and hours of time spent tunning them either. Timmies rig is getting there, and the avenger rig was smooth compared to the other bouncers, but its just not the same.

I would love to see a rig with the stance of boobys rig, and the suspension of millers!!

Mortalis5509 · Apr 7, 2014

Re:

I saw other day on pirate in the for sale section, a u4 with front trailing arms. People posted it was one of the fastest cars and it's a solid front.

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bbone · Apr 7, 2014

Cole said:
Mike Bergman in his buggy called The Statement. Got a little close on this one www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQlPlpEvOBI

6k lbs?....I thought mine was heavy @5k

Cole · Apr 7, 2014

bbone said:
6k lbs?....I thought mine was heavy @5k

Yeah thats what Mike told me it weighed.

Bree Molitor showed out during the shootout with some awesome driving. www.youtube.com/watch?v=uq3oe-wrw_U

Elliott · Apr 7, 2014

She sure has good instincts, and seems to keep her head on good when things get a little out of whack.

zebrajeep · Apr 8, 2014

Re: Ultra4 vs Rockbouncer Shootout

Cole said:
Danny was the fastest bouncer www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6xktCKKljQ

I agree with the tuning comments, however, watch Danny in this video. What does he do differently?
Is it tuning?.......probably not
Is it the line?.......same line as others
Is it the tires?......same as others
Is it more horsepower? Probably not

I think it is smoothness. But what is smoothness exactly? It's somehow keeping the tires on the ground and hooked up.

The guys who win are able to let off and re-apply throttle at EXACTLY the right moments to keep the bounce to a minimum and stay hooked up.

Very impressive.

Cole · Apr 8, 2014

2014 Ultra4 vs Rockbouncer shootout video. I put all the runs together in the order they ran. www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MEknHfR218

TBItoy · Apr 8, 2014

a lot of the ultra4 cars didn't look all that well sorted on that hill climb, still bouncing off the ground, sliding and flipping over.

Most of em did look better coming up the creek bed though

Elliott · Apr 8, 2014

Those ifs cars looked great on that hill, but the other ultra 4 guys I guess are set up so soft that they looked really top heavy, kinda like they woller around.Did TC not make a second run?

tallnate · Apr 8, 2014

Re: Ultra4 vs Rockbouncer Shootout

zebrajeep said:
I agree with the tuning comments, however, watch Danny in this video. What does he do differently?
Is it tuning?.......probably not
Is it the line?.......same line as others
Is it the tires?......same as others
Is it more horsepower? Probably not

I think it is smoothness. But what is smoothness exactly? It's somehow keeping the tires on the ground and hooked up.

The guys who win are able to let off and re-apply throttle at EXACTLY the right moments to keep the bounce to a minimum and stay hooked up.

Very impressive.

yeah I agree. My thoughts are..
1. Some rigs just work on certain hills better than others. I think a lot of this is due to different wheelbase spacing allowing the fronts to bump up before the rears hit and vise versa.
2. Ol yellow has a gangsta lean to the passenger side. I wonder if that helped him stay straight up the hill instead of shooting off to the left like so many others did.
3. Most of all I just think he drove the hill better. He pedaled the throttle just right, bumped the fronts up, matted it, let out, bumped the rears, matted it. He technically bounced it in a sense.