ID small chevy

[joshwho?]

I seriously do not know what you and others cannot understand about this concept. If you were to connect a vac/boost gauge to your intake manifold, as soon as the exhaust gases were sufficient to spool up the turbo to it's rated output, you would find that the turbocharger is producing 3 to 6 POUNDS PER SQUARE INCH of boost PRESSURE, after which time the gauge would remain rock steady, as the waste gate would be regulating the turbo's maximum rated output. This would be NFG if you wanted to know the engine's work load status at any given time. The gauge would ONLY tell you that the turbo is functioning properly.

On the other hand, with the same gauge connected to the manifold of a Roots style blower, the vac/boost gauge would normally show the intake as being under a vacuum state. The only time that the gauge will show PRESSURE IN POUNDS PER SQUARE INCH would be if the engine were under a load, such as climbing a grade or if the throttle plates were close to the WOT position.

Have you ever driven a turbo'd vehicle?

You can be clipping down the road at 6,500rpm and be making 0psi (or have 0 pounds of boost in the intake manifold) until you open the throttle plate or plates enough that the engine sees load and then you will have boost (BEACUSE AT THAT ENGINE SPEED IT IS EXPELLING ENOUGH EXHAUST GASSES TO SPOOL THE TURBO UP).

 

[joshwho?]

Therefore, turbos need a different style of gauge in order to accurately determine the engines work load status. This is accomplished by measuring the WEIGHT of the air which is passing through the turbocharger. The VOLUME of the air is determined in CUBIC FEET PER MINUTE and the WEIGHT of that VOLUME is expressed in POUNDS.

So you think that a turbo'd engine needs a different measuring device for how much boost it is under? Are you saying that the only way to do it is to have a meter that is calibrated to each specific engine at every RPM OFF BOOST to determine when it's actually under boost? :haha::looser:

 

[joshwho?]

Dear joshwho?;
I do realize that the rice rocketing crowd tends to confuse POUNDS OF BOOST(which is a measurement of WEIGHT) with BOOST PRESSURE IN PSI(which is a measurement of applied force) however no one has ever accused any of those guys of being Albert Einstein either.:haha:
Your friend;
LAMAR

You are one of the most narrow minded people I've talked to I think. Can you tell me how the PHYSICS (which ARE what you have been standing on to do your rambling) are any different on/in an imported engine?

P.S. I only used imported stuff as examples seeing as you just couldn't understand how stupid what you were saying was.

 

[joshwho?]

Dear WHITE TRASH;
Hey dipshit, tell me how you can push 32 POUNDS OF PRESSURE through a 2.5" fawking inlet tube? Let's see if your shop's compressor can handle THAT type of requirement? :flipoff:Why YOU get the **** out of here with YOUR trolling?
Your friend;
LAMR

Um dude? Seriously? I'm sure his compressor can supply 32psi through a 2.5" inlet tube... if it's supplying a model airplane engine

What i'm saying is that his shop compressor isn't made or sized to produce boost to an engine, so the post of yours that I quoted here is pointless with NO relation to ANYTHING in this thread.
:trollarse:

 

[joshwho?]

Yep, my boost gauge in my toolbox that I've used for years is an old acetylene gauge. Have I been diagnosing engines wrong for 10yrs because acetylene is lighter than air?
hpoop:

But are you measuring pounds of... Oh ****, I can't even PRETEND to sound as blind as him, even for a joke! :haha:

 

[joshwho?]

Dear Binder;
Actually volume is VERY important when discussing an engine's performance.

Well the volume changes as the engine RPM changes, there you go. More RPM, higher volume of air being consumed.

 

[joshwho?]

He also went to explain that the high boost numbers are not truly indicative of performance. 32 PSI in a 2.5" outlet tube is about the same as 2-3 PSI in the manifold of a blower driven engine.

Higher boost pressure's AREN'T ALWAYS the same as more pressure, but higher boost pressure on the same setup is usually going to increase power until you get to the point of detination (which CAN be raised with properly set-up

turbos, cylinder head designs, flow characteristics, ignition systems, etc.QUOTE] even though you don't seem to THINK so) provided there isn't any intercooler heat soak (from prolonged high boost operation).

Ok, you said at some point that an engine doesn't make more power over 6psi (whell, we all know that's wrong (I HOPE you do too)), so we'll say that a SBC makes 450hp/450tq at 6psi... It's not going to do anything but make MORE power at at 14psi (provided

turbos, cylinder head designs, flow characteristics, ignition systems, etc.QUOTE] fuel and internals are set up correctly and there isn't any detonation. CORRECT? Now let's tey 20psi... Once a again... IT'S GOING TO MAKE MORE POWER. What's so hard about that?

NOW lets say it did that with a small turbo.
Put a larger turbo on and once you start making boost there will be more power per PSI because the exhaust that is flowing more freely allows the engine (AIR PUMP) to flow a higher volume of air/fuel and if the compressor housing is larger then it is more efficent so charge temps come DOWN.

Right? :looser:

 

[joshwho?]

I then asked why not use a belt driven supercharger or a small blower instead of a turbo and he explained that the losses from the supercharger's parasitic drag would be too great for a small engine to be able to cope with, therefore turbos are used.

Try Jackson Racing. They build roots style (honestly could be Lysholm Compressors, I haven't looked into them) and centrifugal superchargers for engines down to 1.5l, so wrong again!

30 seconds on youtube netted me THIS:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvY2n40dFVw

I don't know the guy, but 10psi of manifold pressure, you'd better e-mail him that his guage is lying to him! :fawkdancesmiley:

 

[joshwho?]

Any engine's max output ceiling is not determined by blowers, turbos, cylinder head designs, flow characteristics, ignition systems, etc. The determining factor of a engine's maximum power potential is regulated by the octane rating of the fuel.

So quench, piston design, chamber design, piston/chamber relationship, ignition (cooler sparkplugs and plug design fall into this catagory as do CDI systems, boost-retard, etc), FLOW CARACTERISTICS? and overall V/E have no bearing on how much power an engine makes or how much boost it can handle? :jerkit:

 

[joshwho?]

All of the trick components in the world will not allow us to work around the inescapable conclusion that the maximum compression ratio of today's modern engines is 12.4:1 before detonation occurs. Therefore, unless exotic, and very costly, fuels or fuel additives such as various octane boosters or nitrous oxide are used, the cap of performance is determined by the octane rating of the fuel being used.
Your friend;
LAMAR

MAN! You are blind! :haha:

Also on a different note what do YOU think about E85? Any power to be had there?

 

[Lamar]

Dear Joshwho?;
If you read post #155, you might read where I admitted to being incorrect. Therefore, you are arguing with yourself at this stage, and unless you feel strongly about it, you can stop at any time.
Your friend;
LAMAR

 

[Binder]

30 seconds on youtube netted me THIS:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvY2n40dFVw

I have the same Innovate WB LM-1 like that car has mounted on it's dash.....I would never bother mounting it to rice junk though.:haha:

 

[joshwho?]

I have the same Innovate WB LM-1 like that car has mounted on it's dash.....I would never bother mounting it to rice junk though.:haha:

I love the LM1. Great tool!

 

[joshwho?]

Dear Joshwho?;
If you read post #155, you might read where I admitted to being incorrect. Therefore, you are arguing with yourself at this stage, and unless you feel strongly about it, you can stop at any time.
Your friend;
LAMAR

You might need to break it down for the crowd, because I see nowhere in post #155 where you said you were wrong, just

It would seem that the intake volume requirements for a small engine are much lower than the requirement for a large engine, which is why using a turbo, or even twin turbos, on a high displacement engine are impractical.

We then discussed building engines for maximum power output and the end result was the same as I've been preaching all along. Any engine's max output ceiling is not determined by blowers, turbos, cylinder head designs, flow characteristics, ignition systems, etc. The determining factor of a engine's maximum power potential is regulated by the octane rating of the fuel.
Your friend;
LAMAR

NONE of ANYTHING I read on post #155 seemed even REMOTELY like saying that you didn't know or that you were wrong.

 

[joshwho?]

He also went to explain that the high boost numbers are not truly indicative of performance. 32 PSI in a 2.5" outlet tube is about the same as 2-3 PSI in the manifold of a blower driven engine.

Oh, and the SBC I was talking about is running 3" intercooler piping (which is still undersized).

AND AGAIN, I'M NOT talking about pressure (OR BOOST) levels IN THE PIPING, I'm talking about it IN THE MANIFOLD.

 

[joshwho?]

so I am stoked, I did in fact get a 4 bolt main block:awesomework:
just like all you guys said its a bitchen block cause it will be able to hold up to 1200 hp and @30 PSI boost, with minimal amounts of work, if i decide to go that way?:kiss:

:stirpot:

Good to know that you got what you were looking for!

...but the 2-bolt casting is the one that you would want to start with for a SUPER tough standard casting SBC, but that's fine, because they are damn near free if you can't find one for free! :awesomework: Get a free 2-bolt, sell everything but the block (or keep for spare parts for other engines) to pay to have the block checked for cracks and slowly start a build!

The engine I keep talking about got 12MPG going from Vancouver to Hoodriver and back on a road rally (alot of sprited driving and pleanty of heavy boost) when I drove it out there!

 

[Lamar]

so I am stoked, I did in fact get a 4 bolt main block:awesomework:
just like all you guys said its a bitchen block cause it will be able to hold up to 1200 hp and @30 PSI boost, with minimal amounts of work, if i decide to go that way?:kiss:

:stirpot:

Dear S-Box;
The fact that the block is a 2 bolt or a 4 bolt has nothing to do with how much boost it can handle. What does matter is what type of rotating assembly it has, if any. With higher boost pressures, a forged crank, rods and pistons are pretty much a requirement.

Also, the upper end of the horsepower output for a SBC is about 1.5 HP per CID. This if course is with a Root blower on it. You can put an NOS kit on it as well and get another 100-200 ponies out of it, if you are willing to wring the neck of that beast.

A 454 CID SBC can get up to 675 HP. Anything more than this and you will need to be pricing aluminum blocks. Of course, in order for that badboy to be able to make that 675HP, you will need to drop a BUNDLE of $$$ into it first.

Once a SBC starts to produce more than 475HP, things start getting expensive quickly. At that stage in the game, it becomes cheaper to build a BBC and leave the SBCs to the kids to play around with. A BBC can produce about 1.2 HP per CID, however you also have a lot more of those cubic inches to play around with too. Also, a stock BBC block can safely 1,200 to 1,500 HP all day long.

I've seen the dollar figures for many SBCs that, while they looked and sounded impressive, cost far more than a like BBC for the same HP output. For example, Edelbrock is building blown SBC engines as drop-in replacements that are producing 507 HP on the dyno. The price tag on these engines is around 11,000$ and some change.

On the other hand, for 11K you can build a normally aspirated BBC for less money and with a much greater HP output. Around 675 HP, to be exact. At this point it no longer is advantageous to use a SBC. Again, an Edelbrock BBC 555 CID engine that is normally aspirated with a carburetor has a max HP output of 677 HP and it costs 12,800$.

I am sure there will be people who are going to tell you that they can build a 1000+HP SBC and that there are people who do it all of the time, blah, blah, blah. Unfortunately, unless you are going to be using nitrous, it's pretty much impossible for a 350C CID SBC to produce 2.85 HP per CID. Also, by using nitrous with a high performance engine (read that as *high dollar* engine) you will be taking a huge gamble that everything is going to stay together.
Your friend;
LAMAR

 

[Binder]

At this point it no longer is advantageous to use a SBC.

There are other reasons to use a SBC over a BBC. Size and weight are two big ones.:;

 

[WHITE TRASH1]

There are other reasons to use a SBC over a BBC. Size and weight are two big ones.:;

No doubt, lighter rotating assembly for faster throttle response, lighter weight out over the front for a more even weight bias etc etc etc.

Lamar's last post proves the hasn't the slightest clue and is full of ****. A small block CAN and WILL make far more than 1.5 hp per cubic inch with a blower/turbo(s) etc on it and it can survive just fine. Keep grasping for straws troll. :haha:

 

["S"-box]

holy chit....you guys are ruthless!:haha::haha: I certainly don't want to start more **** but keep arguing I am hearing some really good stuff, most of which sounds valid :stirpot::stirpot:
back to the tech talk :corn: