Public Meeting

[Binder]

Facts--we are looking at roughly 2000 acres for motorized use--thats not hikers,mountain bikers or horse folks.
Fact--its getting shut down the 2nd temporairly--its going to reopen
Fact--its now up to us the users to make reiter what it will be.
Fact--Its your volunteer work thats going to speed up its reopening--hopefully april
Fact--this is the flagship so to speak for the development of other ORV areas.
Fact--------Its up to us. Its up to the users. Its time to get out from behind your keyboards and get involved. I don't care if its with RTW or any other organization or just yourself--its up to YOU.

How so?

1)1000 acres not 2000.
2) Who said it's up to the users to make it anything? A consultant is going to be hired which has not gone out to bid yet.
3) Who said anything about reopening in April?
4)Nobody said anything is up to the users.

 

[phew]

What i gathered from it was we will be lucky if we get any of it back . He stated that after it is closed they will make an assesment of it then in dec they will try to implament the plan. Come april they should have the place ready for inspection and then they will come out and see if it is ready for use. Remember this is the dnr and ALL affiliated managment groups. So I'll be amazed if much like anything goverment agencys do if it runs on schedule or on budget.

As far as it is up to us now I don't see how you came up with that they stated in the meeting that they are going to have SOME community input about what goes on up there but that was it. They said we could walk in there ( hikers still have access to the area) and look at whats being done. I don't remember hearing in the meeting anywhere that we will actually be able to do anything up there but look at it if you want to walk in. They came acrossed to me the same way i figured they would indecisive as ever.

They offered up a forrest watch program that doesn't exist that was pretty cool went around and tried to sign up for that.

Not to mention the guy pretty well dodged every question asked with well we had a scientific study done.

The area they are giving us back (maybe) is from about the bottom of eat poop and towards index still no wall trail and everything in the lower lot is gone. It looked like they where giving us the area off to the side of the road on the way to index off of rieter road.

 

[The_Shocker]

so, the newspaper article said 2,000 acres for recreational use, but only 1,000 for all motorized use.

But, you said we get 2,000 acres for motorized use.

did their tune change?

They clearly said that the "ORV area" would be 2000. But of that we get HALF for motorized use.

Correct me if I misheard them....

 

[Binder]

The area they are giving us back (maybe) is from about the bottom of eat poop and towards index still no wall trail and everything in the lower lot is gone. It looked like they where giving us the area off to the side of the road on the way to index off of rieter road

This I'm sure is based on the fact that the DNR doesn't own much of Reiter. It will be interesting to see what happens when the consultant learns this...

 

[crash2]

Facts--we are looking at roughly 2000 acres for motorized use--thats not hikers,mountain bikers or horse folks.
Fact--its getting shut down the 2nd temporairly--its going to reopen
Fact--its now up to us the users to make reiter what it will be.
Fact--Its your volunteer work thats going to speed up its reopening--hopefully april
Fact--this is the flagship so to speak for the development of other ORV areas.
Fact--------Its up to us. Its up to the users. Its time to get out from behind your keyboards and get involved. I don't care if its with RTW or any other organization or just yourself--its up to YOU.



1)1000 acres not 2000.
2) Who said it's up to the users to make it anything? A consultant is going to be hired which has not gone out to bid yet.
3) Who said anything about reopening in April?
4)Nobody said anything is up to the users.

Well the speaker clearly stated 2000 acres for the ORV area and also stated the orv area does not include hikers, bikers or horse people.

Yes---its up to the users to make it what its going to be. Without user volunteer work nothing is going to go forward plain and simple because the funds are not there to hire any type of work force. Where did I state its going to reopen in april? Your not reading what I wrote "hopefully" since again at the meeting that month was stated. Please don't put words into my mount.

Again its going to be up to user volunteer work thats going to move this whole process from start to finish.

 

[4xrick]

What a bunch of inconsiderate hillbillies we must look like. Thanks to whomever stood up and asked the crowd to act like civilized adults, but apparently that wasn't clear enough English for the good old boys around me


Short story:
- He stressed the idea that the closure is indeed temporary.
- A lot of area, however, is permanently lost. Get over it. The entire lower (west) area around the first pit will be designated non-motorized use only. Hikers, bikers, horses.
- Regardless of your opinion on how things should be done, the DNR has chosen to fully close the entire area (except to walk-in users) temporarily while work is planned and completed over the winter months. Like it or not, it is the most cost-efficient way to get things done from their perspective and they're trying to do this all on a shoestring budget ($140K).
- He overused the term "scientific process" or whatever it was he kept saying. But regardless, he's right. The physical attributes of the areas being closed to motorized use make them unsuitable for sustainable long-term use. You don't have to major in soil science to understand this.
- The DNR is cognizant of the fact that none of us trust them to make the right decisions with regard to how trails are built. So they're hiring a consultant to collect input from us users and implement that into the plan.
- The end goal is to have a more complete facility with a campground like Middle Waddle, but that won't be for a while yet. The entire plan is estimated to cost $9M.
- The planning process is going on now, with the criteria for implementation scheduled to be finalized in December. Work could begin in January. He mentioned April 1st as a date for evaluation to determine when the area would re-open.
- Over the course of the closure, they are planning to institute a "forest watch" program, particularly on weekends. I assume more information will be going out to people that are on their mailing list as potential volunteers.


I'm sure there's more, but I think that covers most of what I got.

I can't find a digital copy of the map they had posted. I thought they said it was on their website, but I didn't see it. I should have taken a picture.

Very well put.
This is the same basic info that I understood except I don

 

[Binder]

I didn't put any words into your mouth. You wrote "fact". There's no fact involved in what you wrote. Don't mislead people here. Hopefully people will get involved and help but writing evrything as "fact" is misleading.

 

[The_Shocker]

.....

They were taking volunteer names at the sign up stations in the back to help with Construction as well as Repair work. You are correct about "Forest Watch" as I got the same answer from everyone including DNR-Ron, that they don't really have a program anymore per say. Did you sign up for the construction or Repairs? It sounded like that got you on the list to help while it's closed and even before they have their plan they need help fixing more water crossings in areas not in the ORV part.

 

[zukkev]

They offered up a forrest watch program that doesn't exist that was pretty cool went around and tried to sign up for that.

The Forest Watch Program has been around for some time, was just never really implemented or promoted...

 

[crash2]

I didn't put any words into your mouth. You wrote "fact". There's no fact involved in what you wrote. Don't mislead people here. Hopefully people will get involved and help but writing evrything as "fact" is misleading.

Thats not what I got from it and I was 5ft away from the speaker.

 

[japerry]

One (4x4) guy was arguing with me for about 15 minutes and he thought that all the money the DNR makes from trees goes out of state. Some four wheelers have no clue as to what is going on and they were arguing with non wheelers, making "us" look like total idiots. Alot of questions were answered, but I don't think some people were understanding what was being said.

They remind me of those Glenn Beck followers. :stirpot: :stirpot: :stirpot: anywho, I stood up and reminded people that Reiter was going to end up being managed at some point, and that without some plan in action, it'd end up getting sued by WSFW or Ecology, etc and being closed down.

What everyone seems to miss are these two points
1) DNR has been lacking in getting sanctioned ORV areas for 20+ years. The environment in Washington is predominantly 'green' so the legislature naturally feels like this is an issue they should avoid. We haven't organized good enough to make the wheel squeal enough, which has led to where we are now.

2) Regardless of acreage lost, there really is only a fraction of usable, sustainable land. Reiter is a poor place for an ORV park. Too much water, too much unsustainable slopes, etc. My hope is that of the land that we DO get, that it can be KICKASS trail, challenging, and even if not that large, it'll be difficult enough that it'll be enjoyable.

I hope those who did come tonight, realized that DNR is our ally in this. They're not trying to shut us out of trail, but they have to follow the law. Now lets do our part: Be at those work parties, get involved, and help Reiter open ahead of schedule!

 

[Duck Dodgers]

For instance he said that most of the areas were built in the 60's,70's and 80's before people were mountain biking or even Quads were popular. This seems to be our biggest issue with some of the bike crowd that says it was all theirs 30 years ago before we came and ruined all their singletrack trails. It's the evolution of our sports and progress that has created more needs but they haven't been met and hence we have singletrack trails that have been converted for other uses.

The irony of this is found at the North Fork of the Nooksack where Mt. Biking has grown and the 4x4's and single tracks that built part of the place have been closed out of the area.

The bottom line is all the finger pointing and complaining about the "other" users groups needs to stop. We pretty much have the Mt. Bikers backing the ORVs up here in Whatcom county and we will do the same for them. We have managed to get single track, 4x4 and Mt. Bikers all on the same page working in the same direction here and it is starting to catch on. And we are not done yet bringing other user groups into the mix... It's the power in numbers that we need. Not the divide and conquer crap the tree hugger's have been so successful at for years.

 

[crash2]

What i gathered from it was we will be lucky if we get any of it back . He stated that after it is closed they will make an assesment of it then in dec they will try to implament the plan. Come april they should have the place ready for inspection and then they will come out and see if it is ready for use.

As far as it is up to us now I don't see how you came up with that they stated in the meeting that they are going to have SOME community input about what goes on up there but that was it. They said we could walk in there ( hikers still have access to the area) and look at whats being done. I don't remember hearing in the meeting anywhere that we will actually be able to do anything up there but look at it if you want to walk in. They came acrossed to me the same way i figured they would indecisive as ever.

They offered up a forrest watch program that doesn't exist that was pretty cool went around and tried to sign up for that.

Not to mention the guy pretty well dodged every question asked with well we had a scientific study done.

The area they are giving us back (maybe) is from about the bottom of eat poop and towards index still no wall trail and everything in the lower lot is gone. It looked like they where giving us the area off to the side of the road on the way to index off of rieter road

Forest watch program does exhist and I took classes on it a number of years back.

 

[Travis1]

They were taking volunteer names at the sign up stations in the back to help with Construction as well as Repair work. You are correct about "Forest Watch" as I got the same answer from everyone including DNR-Ron, that they don't really have a program anymore per say. Did you sign up for the construction or Repairs? It sounded like that got you on the list to help while it's closed and even before they have their plan they need help fixing more water crossings in areas not in the ORV part.

They still have a forest watch program. At least out in our neck of the woods.

What they haven't had is the people to run a class to get more forest watch people.

 

[crash2]

They remind me of those Glenn Beck followers. :stirpot: :stirpot: :stirpot: anywho, I stood up and reminded people that Reiter was going to end up being managed at some point, and that without some plan in action, it'd end up getting sued by WSFW or Ecology, etc and being closed down.

What everyone seems to miss are these two points
1) DNR has been lacking in getting sanctioned ORV areas for 20+ years. The environment in Washington is predominantly 'green' so the legislature naturally feels like this is an issue they should avoid. We haven't organized good enough to make the wheel squeal enough, which has led to where we are now.

2) Regardless of acreage lost, there really is only a fraction of usable, sustainable land. Reiter is a poor place for an ORV park. Too much water, too much unsustainable slopes, etc. My hope is that of the land that we DO get, that it can be KICKASS trail, challenging, and even if not that large, it'll be difficult enough that it'll be enjoyable.

I hope those who did come tonight, realized that DNR is our ally in this. They're not trying to shut us out of trail, but they have to follow the law. Now lets do our part: Be at those work parties, get involved, and help Reiter open ahead of schedule!

Another thing stated is the structure on what the DNR runs under for recreation is 20+ years old.

 

[crash2]

The irony of this is found at the North Fork of the Nooksack where Mt. Biking has grown and the 4x4's and single tracks that built part of the place have been closed out of the area.

The bottom line is all the finger pointing and complaining about the "other" users groups needs to stop. We pretty much have the Mt. Bikers backing the ORVs up here in Whatcom county and we will do the same for them. We have managed to get single track, 4x4 and Mt. Bikers all on the same page working in the same direction here and it is starting to catch on. And we are not done yet bringing other user groups into the mix... It's the power in numbers that we need. Not the divide and conquer crap the tree hugger's have been so successful at for years.

soooooooo true........ You could hear this very thing happen at the meeting... This finger pointing here and there....lame...

 

[Corey Y]

This I'm sure is based on the fact that the DNR doesn't own much of Reiter.

I was talking to a dirtbike rider and he showed me on the map some of the trails he rides on. I told him the DNR does not own all the land and asked if he had permission from the landowner. He just gave me a blank stare. I suggested if he wants to ride where ever, when ever, he should buy his own property. He walked away.
:haha:

 

[phew]

Forest watch program does exhist and I took classes on it a number of years back.

Thats funny asked about it and they said it was something they where contemplating doing but not happening.

 

[Binder]

Phew...DUDE fix your post quote.

 

[Duck Dodgers]

They still have a forest watch program. At least out in our neck of the woods.

What they haven't had is the people to run a class to get more forest watch people.

Mark addressed this at the Sustainable Recreation meeting in Burlington. They are very interested in aggressively reactivating it again.