BlueMonster1
Active Member
I love it. My trucks all fit that description perfectly, but I have to wonder if requiring chassis mounted servos might be the one thing that keeps someone out of the class. Not all chassis's offer that as an option.
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Help Support Hardline Crawlers :
Scale Class Discussion WARCRC
- Thread starter grover
- Start date
84Toyota4x4
Well-Known Member
I see a lot of points here as being good ones. I don't compete, but I really like the scale trucks. The only question I can see being raised, is where do you draw the line, which is apparently the same problem you are all having.
The way I see it, is you should have more classes than just "scale" or "crawler" (maybe you do?). I mean, to me, I imagine a scale rig as something that is literally that, a scale version of the fullsize. However, the fullsize what? I see people driving around with tubed out rears and linked suspension on the road, if I made a smaller version true to scale of that, is that still a "scale" vehicle?
Are you trying to establish the scale class as something like only allowing modified stock suspension designs? Therefor, if the rig came stock with leafs, then only modified leaf suspensions are allowed, then, if youre building a scale Jeep Rubi, you can use modified coils, links, etc, is that fair?
On the other hand, if you are building a true to scale truggy, why wouldnt that be scale if it is indeed true to scale? It seems something like that should be in a different class than the more stock scales. More like limiting to modified stock, pro-stock, etc type classes WITHIN the scale spectrum IMO.
Only allowing frame mounted steering? Its rare that you see any truck where the steering is done from the axle (full hydro) in a modified stock form (weekend wheeler), so I would say that frame mounted steering is fair. However, a true to scale truggy might have it, so put it in the pro-stock scale class?
Batteries and other electronics in the frame makes sense to me, the fuel tank and engine on a real truck are in the frame. This seems fair for any class.
Tires I think should be realistic in tread pattern. Also, seems fair for any class.
Also, I feel that not touching the models and only using your hands to hook up lines or straps is fair as well. In real life if you mess up a little, you don't just expect some huge giant to move the truck for you, you work like crazy and tug and pull to get it right. This seems fair no matter what you drive as well.
Things like that. Those are just my thoughts from someone who doesn't even compete or know jack about the competitions, lol.
~T.J.
The way I see it, is you should have more classes than just "scale" or "crawler" (maybe you do?). I mean, to me, I imagine a scale rig as something that is literally that, a scale version of the fullsize. However, the fullsize what? I see people driving around with tubed out rears and linked suspension on the road, if I made a smaller version true to scale of that, is that still a "scale" vehicle?
Are you trying to establish the scale class as something like only allowing modified stock suspension designs? Therefor, if the rig came stock with leafs, then only modified leaf suspensions are allowed, then, if youre building a scale Jeep Rubi, you can use modified coils, links, etc, is that fair?
On the other hand, if you are building a true to scale truggy, why wouldnt that be scale if it is indeed true to scale? It seems something like that should be in a different class than the more stock scales. More like limiting to modified stock, pro-stock, etc type classes WITHIN the scale spectrum IMO.
Only allowing frame mounted steering? Its rare that you see any truck where the steering is done from the axle (full hydro) in a modified stock form (weekend wheeler), so I would say that frame mounted steering is fair. However, a true to scale truggy might have it, so put it in the pro-stock scale class?
Batteries and other electronics in the frame makes sense to me, the fuel tank and engine on a real truck are in the frame. This seems fair for any class.
Tires I think should be realistic in tread pattern. Also, seems fair for any class.
Also, I feel that not touching the models and only using your hands to hook up lines or straps is fair as well. In real life if you mess up a little, you don't just expect some huge giant to move the truck for you, you work like crazy and tug and pull to get it right. This seems fair no matter what you drive as well.
Things like that. Those are just my thoughts from someone who doesn't even compete or know jack about the competitions, lol.
~T.J.
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BlueMonster1
Active Member
See, that was a good, unbiased point of view!
I guess I would agree, mount everything on the chassis, as a real rig is. No matter what, there will always be a "pay to play" aspect to the hobby. If your scaler chassis does not allow for chassis mounted steering you need to buy a new chassis.
I guess I would agree, mount everything on the chassis, as a real rig is. No matter what, there will always be a "pay to play" aspect to the hobby. If your scaler chassis does not allow for chassis mounted steering you need to buy a new chassis.
hotwheels000
Well-Known Member
BlueMonster said:
or make one,almost everything can be modded
hotwheels000
Well-Known Member
grover said:
I like the idea of a trail run for now, its supossed to be fun. We already have comps in the other classes. I think eventially it would be kind of cool to be able to seet up a scoring system of sorts for the scale class. It is goods to have some ground rules though so we dont have to rebuild the trucks if the time every comes for a scale comp
OK if we were to look at a set of rules just for fun:
"Group trail comp"
Min. 2 groups fallow a given trail/course to the end.
Groups can be 2 to 6 trucks per group.
Course has a start and finish gate and a presumed or marked path to fallow. Path may be marked by natural boundries, tenis ball halfs, rope, or chalk depending on terain.
TRUCKS:
We are looking for scale/realistic trucks with 2.2/1.9 sized wheels and tires. Should have steering servo, battery, tranny mounted to chassis (not on the axle like comp trucks). Try to allow as many different styles of rigs to compete even bone stock highlifts should be great.
To WIN!
Drive the most scale truck you can get your hands on skillfully assisting your group to the end of the trail without touching the truck (straps and wiching OK).
If a group can not make the course they are marked from the furthest truck from the end gate. Yes if a guy breaks a front ring and pinion six inches into the course it is the groups job to get R done as a group.
Winning group members will be rewarded with 3 points for first place 2 points for second 1 point for third in addition to the 5 points all tail runners will recive for giving it hell.
No tiebreakers, if all trucks finish in all groups everyone gets 8 points for the day.
OPINIONS BUILDERS/DRIVERS:corn:
"Group trail comp"
Min. 2 groups fallow a given trail/course to the end.
Groups can be 2 to 6 trucks per group.
Course has a start and finish gate and a presumed or marked path to fallow. Path may be marked by natural boundries, tenis ball halfs, rope, or chalk depending on terain.
TRUCKS:
We are looking for scale/realistic trucks with 2.2/1.9 sized wheels and tires. Should have steering servo, battery, tranny mounted to chassis (not on the axle like comp trucks). Try to allow as many different styles of rigs to compete even bone stock highlifts should be great.
To WIN!
Drive the most scale truck you can get your hands on skillfully assisting your group to the end of the trail without touching the truck (straps and wiching OK).
If a group can not make the course they are marked from the furthest truck from the end gate. Yes if a guy breaks a front ring and pinion six inches into the course it is the groups job to get R done as a group.
Winning group members will be rewarded with 3 points for first place 2 points for second 1 point for third in addition to the 5 points all tail runners will recive for giving it hell.
No tiebreakers, if all trucks finish in all groups everyone gets 8 points for the day.
OPINIONS BUILDERS/DRIVERS:corn:
Todd1803
Well-Known Member
Interesting idea, basically making it into a "team" event. Curious as to how the groups are picked? Would teams stay the same during the season, or new ones for each comp?
Now that Devlin and I have proven to be such a formidable build team.....:kissmyass:
Now that Devlin and I have proven to be such a formidable build team.....:kissmyass:
hotwheels000
Well-Known Member
Todd1803 said:
:flipoff: LMAO
I still do not feel a frame mounted steering servo adds to a scale look. But I maybe odd man out.
I am game for a no touch rule on the trail.
But I wonder how many want to build a a body scale 2.2 truck, and out of the total builder group how many want a fun run class(fallow the leader or whatever) or a 3rd comp class.
I think a broder set of guidlines and a for fun run class is the way to go. And if the interest stays withour local group we can tighten things up as the year rolls in.
With no Nat'l scale class what is the hurry?
I am game for a no touch rule on the trail.
But I wonder how many want to build a a body scale 2.2 truck, and out of the total builder group how many want a fun run class(fallow the leader or whatever) or a 3rd comp class.
I think a broder set of guidlines and a for fun run class is the way to go. And if the interest stays withour local group we can tighten things up as the year rolls in.
With no Nat'l scale class what is the hurry?
Toyofast
Member
ronbeck said:
When was the last time you saw a Toyota rolling down the road with a huge black box strapped to the top of it's axle? Most 1:1 4wd rigs have a steering box mounted to the frame rail. It's not that tough to mount the servo off of the axle.
ronbeck said:
Exactly. The USRCCA doesn't have a Scale Class. But most other clubs/groups do... ORCRC, Nor-Cal, UTRCRC, etc. Sure none of them have the same guidlines for building the trucks or how to score them but I'm sure one day they will all merge together just like we have with the 2.2's & Supers.
You guys need to get together for fun rather than only on comp days. Start building your scale rigs, get together and compare your findings on what looks more scale. Setup simple rules/guidelines for building the rigs. Adopt another clubs Scale Class rules/guidelines to get it started.
Less talk and more building.
I can't even start to tell you how much FUN driving a scale build rig is. Sure it doesn't have a ton of flex, but do you really need a lot of flex? Nope. When you get out with the scale rigs it might not seem to be like a scale type of day but you have to make it happen. Get down onto the ground for picters and videos. Get a mini tri-pod that has the flexible legs(~4" tall). Keep human limbs out of the images and so on. Sure some things will still look out of proportion but you'll get over it.
Toyofast said:
I have driven a few chassis mounted steering set ups, and I am just not a fan. Kinda like Ford vs Chevy Vs Mopar Vs import thing. You like what you like. And I have been wanting to run my penguin in front of the axle setup on my jeep.(going to try and finish it today... no fun holidays steeling all my wrench time!)
I think our biggest issue is no Chief.
hotwheels000
Well-Known Member
ronbeck said:
It will vary from chassis to chassis, they all willl have a Z bend drop drag link in common. Generally all you need to do is place a support between the frame rails in front of and behind the servo so you can screw the servo down. If you dont have room to lay it flat you can mount it verticle, COG is not as critical in the scalers IMO
Post a pic of your chassis and I am sure we all will have ideas. Bring it over and Todd and I will measure it up for you.
This time I get the stupid end:flipoff:hotwheels000 said:It will vary from chassis to chassis, they all willl have a Z bend drop drag link in common. Generally all you need to do is place a support between the frame rails in front of and behind the servo so you can screw the servo down. If you dont have room to lay it flat you can mount it verticle, COG is not as critical in the scalers IMO
Post a pic of your chassis and I am sure we all will have ideas. Bring it over and Todd and I will measure it up for you.
hehe I feel the love! :kissmyass: lol
It's just a K2 3 short.
will post some pics later.
Toyofast
Member
ronbeck said:
A FAQ on how to mount a servo? Nope. The hardest part is making sure you don't over think the install.
Since this photo I have altered the servo location to aid in body mounting but since the FJ Cruiser body to toast, I'll probably move it again to give me my battery tray in which I have been waiting to install.
Easiest way to build it on a scale rig it to go look at how a real 1:1 is layed out.
To make the steering work even better is to keep the suspension as low as you possibly can, then you won't have bump steer to really worry about. My first setup gave me a bit of bump steer, now it's not even noticed. The lower the suspension mean that your drag link won't need that silly "Z" bend in it. Any time I see a "Z" bend on a drag link it means that the setup was built incorrectly.
My current setup is almost parrellel, drag link and tie-rod that is.:redneck:
I B RACIN
Well-Known Member
Brett, cut them beads off, or is that your trademark...
Torry
Torry
Toyofast
Member
I B RACIN said:Brett, cut them beads off, or is that your trademark...
Torry
Which beads? There are two sets of wheels on that rig!:redneck: I have since wacked off the Tamiya white spoke inner wheel and painted them flat black to match the Dark Impact wheels.
Thanks for the info Toyo.
here is a pic or two of my truck as it sits.
http://www.nw-wheelers.com/forum/showpost.php?p=142040&postcount=41
here is a pic or two of my truck as it sits.
http://www.nw-wheelers.com/forum/showpost.php?p=142040&postcount=41
hotwheels000
Well-Known Member
Toyofast said:A FAQ on how to mount a servo? Nope. The hardest part is making sure you don't over think the install.
Since this photo I have altered the servo location to aid in body mounting but since the FJ Cruiser body to toast, I'll probably move it again to give me my battery tray in which I have been waiting to install.
Easiest way to build it on a scale rig it to go look at how a real 1:1 is layed out.
To make the steering work even better is to keep the suspension as low as you possibly can, then you won't have bump steer to really worry about. My first setup gave me a bit of bump steer, now it's not even noticed. The lower the suspension mean that your drag link won't need that silly "Z" bend in it. Any time I see a "Z" bend on a drag link it means that the setup was built incorrectly.
My current setup is almost parrellel, drag link and tie-rod that is.:redneck:
Dont you get a lot of deflection/twist in the servo horn with those spacers in there. Last time I ran that way I bent my horn and it was aluminum.of coarse that was with a 5995.
Devlin
BlueMonster1
Active Member
Here is my High Lift setup...
And my Mudder is setup almost exactly the same. I have zero steering problems with either truck.
And my Mudder is setup almost exactly the same. I have zero steering problems with either truck.
