Width Restrictions

[pokey]

well i narrowed my down from 102" to 88" running 44" tires but i have rear steer so it will crawl around stuff real good also narrowed body 12" to keep from rubbing on trees. I think small tires used by a dumbass will do as much damage as big tires.big tires will make deeper holes if a dumdass is behind the wheel. But big tires used responsibly are far less destructive because you can crawl through where small tires will not find traction and cause more damage. I hope no restrictions are imposed but will comply if they are. My two cents.:stirpot:

Heres a big part of the problem. You cant control or legislate stupidity. You can however control or legislate equiptment. The dumbasses have brought this upon us and we all will pay for it one way or another. Case in point. On the middle of the lower Kaner there is a section of trail that goes thru a neck down area. The trail used to go thru the mudhole and straight up the hill. Some dumbass with BIG tires decided to tear the living crap out of the hole thus making it impassable for most trail rigs. Then some Dumbass with little tires made a bypass to go around said mudhole. Now the bypass is tough to get through because its kind of narrow between the trees. So another bypass was created by someone who couldnt make or winch through the mudhole and couldnt fit betwwen the trees After this all came to a head afte memorial day last year the PNW4WDA worked with the FS to create on route through the area. We spent considerable time blocking off the bypasses and making the trail usable again. Now some dumbass has seen fit to clear out one of the bypasses and torn **** up again We stand to loose this section of trail very soon due to the fact that there is no place left to build a sutible bypass due to enviromental issues. The paper work needed to move this trail will take up to 5 years to complete. In the meantime we loose a great piece of trail with no guarntee that we will get it back. Now for the really sad part is that MANY pics and videos have been posted on the web and even commercialy of the Dumbasses that did this damage and what happens ???? they get cheered on sometimes I just dont get it:booo: My point here is Dumbasses come with all size tires and Until we learn to police our own we just better get used to someone else doing it for us:booo:

 

[Digger 5]

A agree that large tires make wheelin easier and can do less damage. Less damage until you have to spin the tires and maybe dig a hole. Once that hole is dug, rigs with smaller tires will have a much harder time.

When Tony first got his Boggers we made him follow us cuz we wanted any holes behind us, not in front of us.

Tighter trails equal harder trails. Hell, most of the trails we run today couldn't have been run with a TJ in 1995 because the TJ track was too wide. Hundreds of trees have been cut so wider rigs can get in and most trails around here are much easier today than they were years back. If the trend continues, I figure in another 15 years my motorhome will fit on most of them. But I guess that's ok, cuz it's considered a full size.:stirpot:

 

[JThompson]

Heres a big part of the problem. You cant control or legislate stupidity. You can however control or legislate equiptment. The dumbasses have brought this upon us and we all will pay for it one way or another. Case in point. On the middle of the lower Kaner there is a section of trail that goes thru a neck down area. The trail used to go thru the mudhole and straight up the hill. Some dumbass with BIG tires decided to tear the living crap out of the hole thus making it impassable for most trail rigs. Then some Dumbass with little tires made a bypass to go around said mudhole. Now the bypass is tough to get through because its kind of narrow between the trees. So another bypass was created by someone who couldnt make or winch through the mudhole and couldnt fit betwwen the trees After this all came to a head afte memorial day last year the PNW4WDA worked with the FS to create on route through the area. We spent considerable time blocking off the bypasses and making the trail usable again. Now some dumbass has seen fit to clear out one of the bypasses and torn **** up again We stand to loose this section of trail very soon due to the fact that there is no place left to build a sutible bypass due to enviromental issues. The paper work needed to move this trail will take up to 5 years to complete. In the meantime we loose a great piece of trail with no guarntee that we will get it back. Now for the really sad part is that MANY pics and videos have been posted on the web and even commercialy of the Dumbasses that did this damage and what happens ???? they get cheered on sometimes I just dont get it:booo: My point here is Dumbasses come with all size tires and Until we learn to police our own we just better get used to someone else doing it for us:booo:

I was told that the "big-azz mudhole" was a bypass. The "bypass on the left of said big-azz mudhole" is the original line... I was told this by several grizzled wheelers from the area. One guy has wheeled Kaner/Shoestring for roughly 35 years. I don't know if this is right, but I tend to believe the old farts!

 

[pokey]

I was told that the "big-azz mudhole" was a bypass. The "bypass on the left of said big-azz mudhole" is the original line... I was told this by several grizzled wheelers from the area. One guy has wheeled Kaner/Shoestring for roughly 35 years. I don't know if this is right, but I tend to believe the old farts!

well I am an old fart ask anyone:haha: and I have been wheeling that trail since 1979 or so:eeek: Just one more crux to that particular mess. For the not street legal guys that like to camp at Crow creek or longmeadows. If that trail was to go away how would you access the trail system?? I see a lot of tickets for running the logging roads around that section in the future if that section is lost:booo:

 

[Gibby1]

I don't agree that tight equals harder. I can make trails harder with technical obstacles such as rocks and mud. Tight trails are a TYPE of difficulty, but I don't find squeezing between two trees to be a particular obstacle. A tight corner is an obstacle, squeezing an 81" wide vehicle between trees that are only 74" wide simple to make a trail difficult, is not in my opinion and good way to make a trail harder.

I don't agree with intentionally widening a trail to that everyone fits. I agree that there should be some trails designed and limited for SWB vehicles, stocking vehicles and extreme vehicle. Not all trails are suitable for all vehicles, not should they, in my opinion.

 

[crash2]

I will wheel anything--I will even go down a dirt road for fun....

If I can't fit then I don't go....... :awesomework:

 

[Digger 5]

Gibby-
I agree, many of the larger trails are full and challenging. The point here is that many of the tight trails have been changed because larger rigs have gone in. Not every rig will fit on every trail. Forcing a full size rig into a tight trail is just wrong.
2 years ago on Memorial Day at Shoestring there was a guy with a blue full size Chev (SB truck or K5 without a top) that made a huge joke about how he was going to run every trail up there. The truck was completely straight and fairly well set up. By the end of the weekend the truck was trashed. There wasn't a straight panel on it and it was about 10" narrower than when it started.
We saw blue paint on trees everywhere and lots of broken branches and new cuttings. New bypasses were seen and broken glass everywhere. I can't honestly say that this one guy did all the damage but you can be sure he did some of it. Is this good for our sport? There are always bad apples but we must not encourage these actions. As others have said, most of the trails around here were built by old flatties decades ago. Don't try and force a full size through just for the challenge. It's selfish and hurts our sport.

 

[Outback]

I will wheel anything--I will even go down a dirt road for fun....

If I can't fit then I don't go....... :awesomework:

X2:stirpot:

 

[Gibby1]

Gibby-
I agree, many of the larger trails are full and challenging. The point here is that many of the tight trails have been changed because larger rigs have gone in. Not every rig will fit on every trail. Forcing a full size rig into a tight trail is just wrong.
2 years ago on Memorial Day at Shoestring there was a guy with a blue full size Chev (SB truck or K5 without a top) that made a huge joke about how he was going to run every trail up there. The truck was completely straight and fairly well set up. By the end of the weekend the truck was trashed. There wasn't a straight panel on it and it was about 10" narrower than when it started.
We saw blue paint on trees everywhere and lots of broken branches and new cuttings. New bypasses were seen and broken glass everywhere. I can't honestly say that this one guy did all the damage but you can be sure he did some of it. Is this good for our sport? There are always bad apples but we must not encourage these actions. As others have said, most of the trails around here were built by old flatties decades ago. Don't try and force a full size through just for the challenge. It's selfish and hurts our sport.

That's a no brainer. Full sizes don't belong on a narrow trail anymore than a stock rig belongs on a hard core trail.

 

[Fullywrecked]

If any of you believe the 1-2% of land we wheel on and enjoy the outdoors has any negative effect on the enviroment you need to learn what suicide is all about. Then take an even larger look and realize that on that 1-2% of land that you using your only driving on under 2% of that land with our/your ORV's.

What happens to alot of this land when they log it. More of that is drivin on and lots of mud is made............and those tree's you were edriving around so carefully are now headed to the mill to build things we all need (like the thing you reside in......your home and paper to wipe your ass). Have you ever seen what a forrest fire does to the area? Have you ever been back a couple years later..........It has all grown back up and tree's are on their way back to being tree's. TREE'S ARE A RENEWABLE RESOURCE. ITS LIKE FARMING! Whats next..............restrictions on cutting down crops for food.

Quite wasting your time and putting restrictions on yourself and try to get people who have correct views in the right places to keep it open.

Fawk width restrictions. Fawk tire size restrictions and Fawk the Sierra Club and anyone who trys to take away my freedom.:flipoff:

 

[Gibby1]

Gibby,
I will have to agree as far as the full size on smaller trails. BUT the stock rig on harder trails i have to disagree because that totally depends on the stock rig and i do hate to blow my own horn but my 07' jeep wrangler rubicon is a very well equipted rig. 32x10x17 tires, dana 44's with 4;10 gears, 4;1 transfercase, 6 speed manual, fuel injected motor, 45 degree approch angle, 43 degree departure angle, 25 breakover, 832 RTI.

My rig has needed very little to beable to follow most all of you out there, new front and rear bumpers, winch, engine/transmission skid plate and future has a 3" lift and 35" tires just because we do get high centered as we are now. As far as a stock rig off the showroom floor, this thing is ready to run because Jeep made it to run mild trails.

these are just my 2 cents worth and what i feel. Yes i love my Ruby.

Kat, a Ruby is somewhat of an exception but I will say this. You made a couple of modifications that are critical, including a winch. Doesn't that Ruby already come with lockers as well? I still wouldn't recommend a STOCK Ruby on the busy in the winter for example, or 197 at Evan's Creek in the winter. Stock does NOT include a winch...

 

[Kat]

Kat, a Ruby is somewhat of an exception but I will say this. You made a couple of modifications that are critical, including a winch. Doesn't that Ruby already come with lockers as well? I still wouldn't recommend a STOCK Ruby on the busy in the winter for example, or 197 at Evan's Creek in the winter. Stock does NOT include a winch...

She does have stanard rear and front electric lockers. If we were to due seroius winter wheeling i would change the tires because the bfg mt kms are NOT goo for that i would almost go with the KM2's.

Like i said before we do have plans for a 3" lift and 35's some time during the winter.

 

[Digger 5]

Fullywrecked-
Most of the lands we wheel on won't be logged. But even if they were, should someone cut a tree just because they choose to run a full size rig on a narrow trail? Hell no!! If you can't run the trail, as is, don't go there. It's that simple.

 

[Not Jobless]

Fullywrecked-
Most of the lands we wheel on won't be logged.

You couldn't be more wrong when it comes to Wester Washington.

Reiter, Walker & Elbe for starters are all logged periodically.

 

[Digger 5]

I wheel primarily in Eastern WA. You're right about Western WA. Not many areas here (West side) that are good for much more than a day trip.

 

[crash2]

You couldn't be more wrong when it comes to Wester Washington.

Reiter, Walker & Elbe for starters are all logged periodically.

I think that is where the difference is between state--federal land...

 

[Fullywrecked]

I wheel primarily in Eastern WA. You're right about Western WA. Not many areas here (West side) that are good for much more than a day trip.

The tree's are not nearly as tight on the east side as western WA, so it really doesn't matter. I didin't say anything about taking the trees down while wheelin, but I know I can do all the trails at 80" wide just fine.

Logging doesn't destroy the whole ecosystem, niether does wheeling.

 

[Fullywrecked]

I wheel primarily in Eastern WA. You're right about Western WA. Not many areas here (West side) that are good for much more than a day trip.

Primarly because of all the Buearocratic tree hugging homo's who have closed down those area's so we are so limited to the areas we can go wheel. It could happen on your side of the mountians if people don't put there foot down.

 

[Brian H]

If any of you believe the 1-2% of land we wheel on and enjoy the outdoors has any negative effect on the enviroment you need to learn what suicide is all about. Then take an even larger look and realize that on that 1-2% of land that you using your only driving on under 2% of that land with our/your ORV's.

What happens to alot of this land when they log it. More of that is drivin on and lots of mud is made............and those tree's you were edriving around so carefully are now headed to the mill to build things we all need (like the thing you reside in......your home and paper to wipe your ass). Have you ever seen what a forrest fire does to the area? Have you ever been back a couple years later..........It has all grown back up and tree's are on their way back to being tree's. TREE'S ARE A RENEWABLE RESOURCE. ITS LIKE FARMING! Whats next..............restrictions on cutting down crops for food.

Quite wasting your time and putting restrictions on yourself and try to get people who have correct views in the right places to keep it open.

Fawk width restrictions. Fawk tire size restrictions and Fawk the Sierra Club and anyone who trys to take away my freedom.:flipoff:

Very well said Jeremy. :awesomework: X2

 

[CHOP SHOP]

You couldn't be more wrong when it comes to Wester Washington.

Reiter, Walker & Elbe for starters are all logged periodically.

no **** the trails at elbe are alot different now than before.it all gets cut eventually. these trails are a farm. it gets harvested regularly.:awesomework: