DNR update

xjoffroad · Oct 15, 2009

Count me in as "help" we all have to try harder now to keep this place open!

4xrick · Oct 15, 2009

crash said:
Sorry guys I was hoping somebody from last nigth would pop in--but I only have a few so here ar the facts.

First the meeting--this is part of the pre-planning for the ORV park --some things have to be roughed in before the ORV public meeting can be aproved by DNR and public meeting on it

the area is closing the 2nd(again we are hoping just the upper).

The area is being closed down so planning and building of 1-parking camping area and 2 trail plan made and built. Now I know some will say well the area should stay open. My opnion is you cannot build an ORV area(not improve and build up on an established area like elbe/evans and so forth)when its in use..

This is all I know right now and from my standpoint this is great--we have to give up something for a while.

How long--that will depend on funds and "VOLUNTEER HELP" to get the trails made.

Again this is what I know guys....

ok--I have spent too much time I gotta make some $$$

x2. There is good coming guys - you just have to understand it takes time and we are going to get good things in the end of all this.

BeatCJ · Oct 15, 2009

One thing that may make some difference in people's thoughts is that this isn't a Public Meeting. It's a Meeting in Public. And yes, there is a huge difference.

I spent a couple of days this week working with DNR staff, on an unrelated situation. http://www.columbian.com/article/20091011/NEWS02/710129942/-1/NEWSLOCAL

What I found, talking with DNR Staff members from my area (I'm including staffers from the Olympia area) is EVERY SINGLE ONE of them supported the effort down here to open up OHV trails in this area. Why? Because having us out there will cut down on the people that destroy the area. They know that having OHV trails will increase their workload. They don't care. Most DNR employees are hard working people with interests the same as yours and mine. They support people that get out and work. They don't like being talked down to, or about, but if you are cooperative and really care, they will listen to your thoughts and concerns, and try to work with you.

They aren't into conspiracies to shut us out of the woods, they know that state lands have to be managed for recreation. For years, the only voice that was organized enough to get through were those that wanted motorized out of their "pristine" environment. OK, DNR's primary mission is raising a cash crop to fund schools, so very little DNR managed land is pristine anymore, no more than a wheat or cornfield. Things have changed, and finally they are listening to OHV groups. At least the groups that are worth listening to, and don't try to shout everyone else down, and minimalize everyone else's point of view.

I would suggest you will get far more value out of calm conversation than any yelling will accomplish.

Good Luck, the way you behave affects everyone else in the state. So please, Grow the F^(% up.
Thanks

Spanaway Mudder · Oct 15, 2009

CHOP SHOP said:
we got bullied down here. They told us it would hurt to come in crowds.

We came in crowds and the DNR got the hint and the restriction was thrown out the window.

Just from my experience with the dnr.

When 2,000 angry folks show up to find out why their favorite riding/wheeling area is going away it will wake them up as to how big of a problem they are going to have when they put in gates.

Finally somebody that knows about what really happened chimed in

CHOP SHOP said:
Its hard to gain trust with the "you have to be in the know and invited"n thing going on.

Nobody trusted the folks handling the DNR issues here untill Steve got involved and it was loud too. People trust Steve. The dnr was suprised at how many people cared enough to show up and protest this crap.

:awesomework:

CHOP SHOP said:
This is exactly what we did at big elbe dnr meeting. It works.:cheer:

ELBE HAS DONE NOTHING BUT GET BETTER SINCE:awesomework:

CHOP SHOP said:
why is the meeting somewhere other than reiter?

Wouldnt it make sense to have a HUGE meeting at the lot where the users are?

seems there would be enough room to have a crowd

:corn:

CHOP SHOP said:
so if its closed on nov 2 whats the difference between wheeling it on nov 3rd and wheeling it for years past?
Its never been a legal wheeling spot.

Thats a very good point B-rad...:awesomework:

Does the DNR really think they will beable to keep ALL ORV users out during that time? I understand that those who dont obey the rules that are set by the DNR will only hinder the positive forward movement..

But Damn.. Everytime I goto Elbe or Reiter even Most if not ALL the "By-passes" and Closed off trails are ripped up...

Iam hoping for a positive outcome.:awesomework:. But reality is reality!! There are some/ALOT that just dont give a **** and dont WEB WHEEL and hear all of this hype...

Just my .02:corn:

dirtygoat · Oct 15, 2009

OK, just to make myself clear to everyone...

I am not promoting a group voice(mob) outside the meeting on Tuesday...

I can see that happening though, like at the "Elbe Meeting"...

I've worked with the DNR and understand how efficient a meeting can be with just a small group focusing on the issue at hand...

Letting everyone know the details beforehand, even if it is limited, will put a lot of people at ease...

It's obvious with all the posting regarding this matter on a number of forums, that people want some sort of an answer...

I believe that giving an honest answer, not holding anything back, is the best policy... Even if the answer isn't what people want to hear...

This is why I've asked the questions that I have...

You guys and gals, that are working directly with the DNR on this matter, have my full support... And I would hope that other people concerned with the furture of Reiter fell the same way...

crash2 · Oct 15, 2009

dirtygoat said:
OK, just to make myself clear to everyone...

I am not promoting a group voice(mob) outside the meeting on Tuesday...

I can see that happening though, like at the "Elbe Meeting"...

I've worked with the DNR and understand how efficient a meeting can be with just a small group focusing on the issue at hand...

Letting everyone know the details beforehand, even if it is limited, will put a lot of people at ease...

It's obvious with all the posting regarding this matter on a number of forums, that people want some sort of an answer...

I believe that giving an honest answer, not holding anything back, is the best policy... Even if the answer isn't what people want to hear...

This is why I've asked the questions that I have...

You guys and gals, that are working directly with the DNR on this matter, have my full support... And I would hope that other people concerned with the furture of Reiter fell the same way...

Thank you...

Corey Y · Oct 15, 2009

CHOP SHOP said:
we got bullied down here. They told us it would hurt to come in crowds.

We came in crowds and the DNR got the hint and the restriction was thrown out the window.

Just from my experience with the dnr.

When 2,000 angry folks show up to find out why their favorite riding/wheeling area is going away it will wake them up as to how big of a problem they are going to have when they put in gates.

Where are these 2,000 people when we have Elbe DNR group meetings or work partys? :booo: Or when we need petitions signed?

Even if we had 400 people at every work party we could open up 4 miles of new trails and the DNR would be our bitches. Elbe has 8 miles now, we can have 12, but there is not enough volunteers to do maintenence on the existing area, let alone new trails.

Most people just want to wheel, not keep the areas open to the standards required by the DNR.

It is difficult to get people to simply pick up empty beer cans.

"dude, im just a wheeler, I dont do work parties or meetings" do you know how many times I have heard that?

Spanaway Mudder · Oct 15, 2009

Crazy Daze said:
Where are these 2,000 (Thats not here nor there Corey!!!)people when we have Elbe DNR group meetings or work partys? :booo: Or when we need petitions signed?

Even if we had 400 people at every work party we could open up 4 miles of new trails and the DNR would be our bitches. Elbe has 8 miles now, we can have 12, but there is not enough volunteers to do maintenence on the existing area, let alone new trails.

Most people just want to wheel, not keep the areas open to the standards required by the DNR.

It is difficult to get people to simply pick up empty beer cans.

"dude, im just a wheeler, I dont do work parties or meetings" do you know how many times I have heard that?

Corey.. I dont agree with you all the time, but god damnit!! Your right on point with this post!!!:awesomework:

IF my mostly crippled ass can get out there and clean up the trails I enjoy wheeling on and spending countless hours on, Then NONE OF YOU HAVE AN EXCUSE!!!

I have people on here that will vouch that it hurts them to see me even out there from the pain I go thru just trying to "help out" with volunteer hours!!

If you dont work with them or the associations that that work to keep OUR trails open, THEN DONT BITCH WHEN THERE CLOSED!!!!!!!

Money Mark · Oct 15, 2009

Reiter Foothills Meeting Postponed Several Days

Reiter Foothills Meeting Postponed Several Days

Greetings,

The Washington State Department of Natural Resources (DNR) recently sent you an invitation you to an October 20 meeting to discuss several important developments regarding Reiter Foothills.

This e-mail is to let you know the meeting is going to be re-scheduled for later that week. There is a lot of interest in the information we plan to share, and we need a larger meeting space. Please stay tuned for an update regarding new date and location. Please forward this information to any people you shared the original invitation with.

Candace Johnson
Assistant Region Manager, State Lands
Northwest Region
Washington State Department of Natural Resources (DNR)
360-854-2803

[email protected]

www.dnr.wa.gov

CC:

Ted Jackson (Reiter Foothills Planning Committee)

Les Leonard (Reiter Foothills Planning Committee)

Rick Rice (Reiter Foothills Planning Committee)

Ed Tenney (Reiter Foothills Planning Committee)

Tod Peterson (WOHVA)

Mike Liebold (Snohomish ORV)

Mike Kash (Reiter Trail Watch, NW Wheelers)

Kat Clark (Reiter Trail Watch, NW Wheelers)

Charley Preston (Reiter Trail Watch, NW Wheelers)

William Schooler (NW Quad Association)

Phil Nye (NW Quad Association)

Steve Pokrandt (GBNT ORV Club)

Gary Lawver (Puget Sound Trialers)

Pete Wisner (Stumpjumpers Motorcycle Club)

Rick Wygle (Wheelers of Washington)

Mark Lynum (NW Wheelers)

dirtygoat · Oct 15, 2009

I would guess that they are watching everything that we are posting... As well as what is being posted on other boards...

Please think about what you post before you click...

These are the things that might have an impact on the way things go down...

Money Mark · Oct 15, 2009

Queef.

dirtygoat · Oct 15, 2009

Elegant as always...:redneck:

Mark m. · Oct 15, 2009

I do beleive that the people that work in the field for the DNR do want to keep places open but the bottom line is that its not really up to them if a place stays open or not.

CHOP SHOP · Oct 15, 2009

Money Mark said:
Queef.

Mark your "my guy" up north.:awesomework: Alaways informed.:;

nate8887 · Oct 16, 2009

CHOP SHOP said:
Mark your "my guy" up north.:awesomework: Alaways informed.:;

:awesomework::awesomework:

pokey · Oct 16, 2009

nate8887 said:
Why is ther no PNW4WDA being represented?

Ed Tenny is the region 1 landmatters chair for the PNW4WDA Kat is also a PNW4WDA member.

zukkev · Oct 16, 2009

pokey said:
Ed Tenny is the region 1 landmatters chair for the PNW4WDA Kat is also a PNW4WDA member.

Ahhhh, true enough!! :awesomework:

pokey · Oct 16, 2009

4xrick said:
Why is it that people who are not involved to begin with who only wheel and do nothing else to help reiter, all of a sudden want to step in when they hear it is closing - and its not even closing for good.
The fact that its closing temporarily is a good thing at this time, so we can move forward with making Reiter Foothills a legitimate place to wheel for all users in the future.

If you feel that there is no one there to represent you, then maybe you should get involved with a group or association that is currently active in what is transpiring at Reiter, or for that matter, in the wheeling community in general. Somewhere within one of those established organizations, you can vote for your representative, and feel that your concerns are adequately addressed, and then relayed back accordingly.

Well said.I have been at this game longer than most on here knew what wheeling was and one thing has always ran true. The officials in charge want to work with informed dedicated people. This is why focus groups and committees are formed. Members of these groups work hard at keeping up with what's going on and keep their constituents informed of the agencies wishes,ideas and needs and also represent the needs of the users. This process works and keeps things moving forward. There is a time and a place for large meetings and people need to trust their representives to tell them when that time is. Meetings by mob put the agencies on a defensive mode and really are not very productive. The agencies hands are quite often tied by laws and regulations that the "average" doesn't understand or even want to take the time to. I have seen several comparisons to the Elbe fiasco in this thread. That entire "meeting" while having "some" good outcome(educating some users) was based on a lie from one person. There never was a restriction planned just a idea brought to the table and then blown wayyyyyy out of proportion. Try to respect your leaders on this and you will get respect back from the agency. If you don't belong to a group thats being represented at this meeting well then maybe you need to look at yourself and ask why:eeek:

And btw there were about 200 or so people at the Elbe meeting not 2000. This just goes along with what started the whole fiasco in the first place. If you tell a lie enough times people will take it for a truth:booo:

japerry · Oct 16, 2009

I think most of the productive responses have been said here already, I wanna add just this..

1) Reiter had a 1.6 Million dollar investment so its not closing indefinitely. It makes sense to close parts under construction, and DNR should be commended for planning the construction during the off-season to minimize impact.

2) THANK YOU to everyone working on the backend to get this area managed. Looking at places like NF/P5000, Reiter had two options.. be closed or become a managed property. There are too many people to let the past continue unchanged. Without the efforts of the handful of people doing the research, making the contacts, going beyond 'the wheel', Reiter would suffer the same fate. For that, they deserve our respect and gratitude.

zukkev · Oct 16, 2009

japerry said:
I think most of the productive responses have been said here already, I wanna add just this..

1) Reiter had a 1.6 Million dollar investment so its not closing indefinitely. It makes sense to close parts under construction, and DNR should be commended for planning the construction during the off-season to minimize impact.

2) THANK YOU to everyone working on the backend to get this area managed. Looking at places like NF/P5000, Reiter had two options.. be closed or become a managed property. There are too many people to let the past continue unchanged. Without the efforts of the handful of people doing the research, making the contacts, going beyond 'the wheel', Reiter would suffer the same fate. For that, they deserve our respect and gratitude.

X2, Well said....A big thanks to ALL those who are taking their time to help with moving this forward!!!!:awesomework: